From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org Received: from vger.kernel.org (vger.kernel.org [23.128.96.18]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 432B1C433F5 for ; Sun, 2 Oct 2022 19:43:50 +0000 (UTC) Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S229505AbiJBTnt (ORCPT ); Sun, 2 Oct 2022 15:43:49 -0400 Received: from lindbergh.monkeyblade.net ([23.128.96.19]:44740 "EHLO lindbergh.monkeyblade.net" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S229479AbiJBTnr (ORCPT ); Sun, 2 Oct 2022 15:43:47 -0400 Received: from mout-xforward.gmx.net (mout-xforward.gmx.net [82.165.159.12]) by lindbergh.monkeyblade.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BE49A356FF; Sun, 2 Oct 2022 12:43:37 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=gmx.net; s=badeba3b8450; t=1664739801; bh=1N/BY4GbK9OGomBQOkwPGGGCw2WbYCDrurO2rs4vxCk=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Date:Subject:To:Cc:References:From:In-Reply-To; b=gdApzSkDmhPc+4L3XvcmbzStNcFPoNitfNgvskXgISDeMWYZEbdmOEZ0CJwlT/EBu I6KxqtUET20Tkjm4AioLskehs0nZBNwja3R5UBwSa/syKvcP4GpAi4V+5jgBcp+rKC nTVAlcloL5zhAWlOC/H1ZbHbDT2oodciK9tkx3WI= X-UI-Sender-Class: 01bb95c1-4bf8-414a-932a-4f6e2808ef9c Received: from [10.13.110.23] ([143.244.37.73]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx005 [212.227.17.184]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1MhD6W-1pAJ591jak-00eN7p; Sun, 02 Oct 2022 21:43:21 +0200 Message-ID: Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2022 19:43:19 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Planned changes for bugzilla.kernel.org to reduce the "Bugzilla blues" To: Konstantin Ryabitsev Cc: Theodore Ts'o , Thorsten Leemhuis , Greg KH , workflows@vger.kernel.org, LKML , Linus Torvalds , "regressions@lists.linux.dev" , ksummit@lists.linux.dev, Mario Limonciello References: <9a2fdff8-d0d3-ebba-d344-3c1016237fe5@gmx.com> <83f6dd2b-784a-e6d3-ebaf-6ad9cfe4eefe@gmx.com> <79bb605a-dab8-972d-aa4a-a5e5ee49387c@gmx.com> <20221002150522.ul4nbtfawqjhnsag@meerkat.local> From: "Artem S. Tashkinov" In-Reply-To: <20221002150522.ul4nbtfawqjhnsag@meerkat.local> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:dhmH3/3j4OAaSxDMTKZ+mRy+8ACrHoYuWy9hk08q/qqA6iPwAVz 8NwALnLWVmwgGDqkp4hS+X+tc8r51uwA37qH+vLViczeC2uG0ZMSM19ZZlf7gIAMsey1Hja 6SDs6YLVjtaWf4qKj8f+GwetSMiFohfOrwhdR5UijAYtUl+Zkoqx64Z5htcPFI+BVSCUyWU WJkUx7nFhHtjusIRa3XpA== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: junk:10;V03:K0:TmLiSiIvHl8=:s41ShGwvziyL6bVXlJIuYE8z cHBo7EFNN7GhJD524r0UFw/G+ZyrAkEs/eGbTiVSpmfqrxR31tLlJ1Swh+/vhe6i/Iym8P92f w5FzNhSLvB9Ofk/Se2hpRZPIyS4FBYQETUu2tEVuLKmCzppqt1WI26XB+8EDQoivc5ei2Dnmc TPm7OeqdW123cxMR2p2J4ZSEuikQiHxHFFKCE5EKU5Ins+rXW3BL8opLRzHpFsNPInNHfmOWF BnHJwnqwwFjzX0/zCrVzPtw5FTBcEWkEn3/A+7DU2ODQCw3Hkme++tBmAA6GH289VYq0xLx3G 44sXeZQgoVDpYVR+eYmDmCh3zV/akycxsIRgXrj2qgXMqb6uGhbW6Waals1mai1lgZ4wwpT5F N6Lpfg3c8aVxVqnGdnirKXNKsw0FSpQgpx5C4C4qmue99rN1cdaypVEkRDWh0gL5+ZG+DNExp y86TvRfJiXVWCJkhhVcXYyrd/K4sBqSQXZL8ZGIMGYZ9JrxhzisTqCCjng3OLk9J7TZFe4LiU q3Pd/l2zaw+bumsfwZnuf+R69wZ5REtHUvxkBaBR35RP32x+3SzzUt9i2GZF1OEfGQ4RJ89Uj yiwE8X5xHnjM/BCijw3T6Y59IcM0a56UOXhenSKAHcvawiYzic353Vh6hQ9T+hWl17o5A3YSc +Ef/qRfwSMsQCq2/23wnEO7ZoY9mwKXBwEs/v1KdztvRc/oaL6NZVbfVnRwI+VXlbRNGhU8Uc Xl2S9RVLcBT5q2LQCYpEtwXzM4sfse2+nTtXjYGyQ1OjGLZNgyZoIR9rTTP7uWJjh9jeZocTS WWDgrrBbmyIUJaub30CRybmLyKLqDpp3frTVMuhfLzv96vMwi31YIus8VrVvyl5SILhMe/lxD YRubvrV/nVqVvl3Voor1LLbcKG4dhk5/Qd1siaWX11dtj9ThdfvdPr7G0+1D2SYuTSVaFvEDJ 2u7Vd29twrIBNNoINpixr850n6tjq5dJQwjafMnj4QFsnM+2U7YI1CF9RHu6G1QpNUsCjk4uJ kmedAvSq4CceVic79XxZbjvVhAd3ss4VL9w8kfd1gLi2ort1i87wGF8J+GZIRzNRApiyrb2RM svuJFTak+gDwuEY2xFw0EIGy1Gl1TKT5CAQvHoKpGb82Tg6q0+RuVInnSzXyJ+m6YEonkprhm iFwMIRhHN7sV5z6Og8/2W4hgx1CRvgo5+8Ar35WFRya5MQ== Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: workflows@vger.kernel.org On 10/2/22 15:05, Konstantin Ryabitsev wrote: > On Sun, Oct 02, 2022 at 12:49:04PM +0000, Artem S. Tashkinov wrote: >> I've mentioned it a dozen times already - you're unhappy with emails >> from bugzilla? Go there and unsubscribe. It takes a minute and we're >> talking as if it's the actual issue we are dealing with. It's not. >> Bugzilla maintenance and its up-to-date status are the issues. > > I think you're working from the wrong conception that maintainers want t= o > receive (or even be aware) of bug reports. Maintainers want *PATCHES*, n= ot bug > reports. You're asking senior engineers to do first-line QA. > > This is why your suggestion to auto-subscribe maintainers to bug reports= is > the absolutely wrong way to go about it. The maintainers will complain t= hat > they're being inundated with spam and junk reports, and bug reporters wi= ll > complain that they are being treated rudely (because this is how a senio= r > engineer trying to get succinct information comes across). You know that= meme > from Fallout with the words "[Everyone hated that]" on it? There's no need to exaggerate or say words like "inundated", please refer to my previous emails about bugzilla stats. Again, to remind everyone, bugzilla sees around ~20 bug reports _weekly_. There are hundreds of active of kernel developers. That means for a single bug report maybe a couple of people will receive maybe a few emails per week. Is this really an _issue_? Why are people are now blowing stuff out of proportion for no reason? This conversation alone has already seen close to three dozen emails and no one is complaining. > >>> And if we force developers to get Bugzilla spam whether they want it >>> not, and they said, "absolutely not", is it there right to have the >>> mailing list gateway disabled --- and if so, what does that do to the >>> user experience? Thats basically the situation we have right now. >> >> As I've said many times already: bugzilla must be an opt-out, not opt-i= n >> experience/option. > > Please listen to the actual maintainers telling you that this won't work= and > will just lead to bugzilla being added to everyone's block list (that's = even > faster than logging in to bugzilla, finding where to change the default > assignee, etc). It feels to me there are no actual maintainers here. Just random people who oppose to a imaginary torrent of emails they've never actually seen. At the same time everyone here is OK getting a hundred emails from LKML _daily_. Regards, Artem