From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org Received: from vger.kernel.org (vger.kernel.org [23.128.96.18]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F6B3C433F5 for ; Mon, 3 Oct 2022 08:36:49 +0000 (UTC) Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S231650AbiJCIgs (ORCPT ); Mon, 3 Oct 2022 04:36:48 -0400 Received: from lindbergh.monkeyblade.net ([23.128.96.19]:58926 "EHLO lindbergh.monkeyblade.net" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S231685AbiJCIgQ (ORCPT ); Mon, 3 Oct 2022 04:36:16 -0400 Received: from mout-xforward.gmx.net (mout-xforward.gmx.net [82.165.159.42]) by lindbergh.monkeyblade.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CCA23275FC; Mon, 3 Oct 2022 01:09:15 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=gmx.net; s=badeba3b8450; t=1664784553; bh=gucUevQeUc5hHlWYZ1t++7IBfAQIeAFhv0oKVclAfIg=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Date:Subject:To:Cc:References:From:In-Reply-To; b=GVDIvyINq8J9hfGX4AkL5aMfzaKQQClit+aZtDdwFCp1eGlrRMfQeBAeV0YImcdcR xft++okYhmgF5CH2kir0A7J6Q7m2tqD1fpesl86RjFEgnWxVCHRvLxGjO7zdEJA4YX 9ErBdCWbCpD2NT7Lieo0RpMQUilgS9GMV53wpIx0= X-UI-Sender-Class: 01bb95c1-4bf8-414a-932a-4f6e2808ef9c Received: from [10.25.110.16] ([143.244.37.214]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx105 [212.227.17.174]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1MZCbB-1ok1Jv3NsP-00V9JH; Mon, 03 Oct 2022 09:41:11 +0200 Message-ID: Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2022 07:41:08 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Planned changes for bugzilla.kernel.org to reduce the "Bugzilla blues" To: Al Viro Cc: Steven Rostedt , Theodore Ts'o , Thorsten Leemhuis , Greg KH , Konstantin Ryabitsev , workflows@vger.kernel.org, LKML , Linus Torvalds , "regressions@lists.linux.dev" , ksummit@lists.linux.dev, Mario Limonciello References: <83f6dd2b-784a-e6d3-ebaf-6ad9cfe4eefe@gmx.com> <79bb605a-dab8-972d-aa4a-a5e5ee49387c@gmx.com> <20221002141321.394de676@rorschach.local.home> <6de0925c-a98a-219e-eed2-ba898ef974f8@gmx.com> <20221002180844.2e91b1f1@rorschach.local.home> <3a3b9346-e243-e178-f8dd-f8e1eacdc6ae@gmx.com> From: "Artem S. Tashkinov" In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:DrgNFBxbBqk2s5Xnd5PRKt9UfYXricJ/EagAW0B9qrRTS4uYGrL Sy8BI4SytsvmGYtePFS3P0kMJWuczigBCyTfVCaTlYZ04ms1wp0oLvwbZqfM8jyKv7n2VRU 8PX2fIBmOulVnDNumjjryF8/NyLnR4DUk6cqUz3kjUqlE+rINg42rKrYqDoq/YMNUl2X4wy ztXBa3EbIk6W+SHrE/l8w== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: junk:10;V03:K0:gQ/lok7QW9I=:zgw0wtN3N6tgjjzk1HxqgM2s DO6sR6dORNdawEUkws5LvaI9mRxg5QZrDqjdL2l1jG4ts+6zVRLNxcxaqIOspqtyes7p9OyON J+zLVY4baooP55wIGTg98lE8JuCqrGbnbxSy3ttRuPv21r1gjuUM9wEKf27iWMaZnD/OINkfS 6UcUxYuROd/W6Z0hdDAnBg8L4NiYi+FYf2rEeKjKD1Bb4hjIWXKvu33SRiQIfLLyQCO0xV1aY qbAFw6lu814OEJM9EBJ0nA6XtCnImpUDdiibH2mj+gUs0tOW5swl3r9Y+zpeYlKuEP1JgjaZt +j4fUfzwXC9d6QzITp3tIPD2VXmu2rpjxw0cQRQIF+9bLRxxB2msWnuIpFnqhsI22pPa4c2Uk k/h6DqHwLG1EG9OWyIylTOcNXe+u1aS+CSfR9P6gBJiWQTGt9H76Saf2hTs/mqBcX8NTrz5ui PF9VEFEUF8T/M56lorElfB351i1Yk78G2C5jAzFkYEgp/LYdh1njT8gFYlB2jazYvr1xUIPhr 9E7Xc9919MwI32Eb0DVoGlnOLkqBHMadZfeIofbm8L5FNoIT0QiuqctwNxUe+0zITFI4Ht2DN LK0UyHVOEjDJdszcXscCLIoLj3G73jRr/lIi6jxpmmoi1aWAekMsg+m1ONd1olb8l8a76RFB9 WzoYrrCbLX3yktnejMTSlWg6onhgKhZ6FgH3P+VyjUrwSD63WoSeNwm4wtHD7JAnQba3LHTNV Kfy07ghd5c5pMT0hhwgSwYWtdim2VIF+PYLfSgPY1ndrfLlqp68pfmj5V7yfpi2yJV/8uZu7Y ocGTzhDgBKJVGjCLZFS+5HDSYv8O9/NoFVDiBKVV1TeCMyNeztkHe0vRacusxrnYKtVV8JgBd ZEqmpcsqkFZ8hiK4+etEhkjuI5TQj2SSGyz/FE4e0MlwsxrwLr4if0JhCRiUAo9mFwJLQHwb1 H0zrooe1Z2DYGlKKMTH2Ux7AfYC0FB+n4iXaP7PxXNYcHLj7sTFj1KavNPkUbe8n+5ysvm6Cl I2p/ow0lMttEBATcfPQMqOnVY+W+FBE4WMuqvxWofw04NRlcfEY2o5RE+nJO3vbcwQZzT0/lk UQG4bM/SYX2432+8HGSWJqghjBOG//xuC073E9Wi9PM3fdnkesMWccANlEXEuGyNea8kk73y7 OMf1eTEIfz+tOFBS6ufAWg5UqGI3nW6et5y6GCswB8mXpw== Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: workflows@vger.kernel.org On 10/2/22 23:04, Al Viro wrote: > On Sun, Oct 02, 2022 at 10:20:40PM +0000, Artem S. Tashkinov wrote: > >> Bugzilla hasn't been updated in a very long time so it's missing both >> mailing lists and individual kernel developers. >> >> AFAIK, some pieces of kernel have no appropriate mailing lists at all. >> What about that? I've no clue. > > There's that file, right in the root of the source tree. Called "MAINTA= INERS", > in all-caps... Could have something to do with locating maintainers, co= uld it not? > >> Opt-in will work, except I've no idea how to make it work. Mass email >> all the kernel developers and politely invite them to sign up? Most wil= l >> simply ignore it. > > Sigh... You really don't seem to appreciate just how deep a septic > tank you've jumped into with your combination of "it should be opt-out" > and "but unsubscribing takes just a minute, what are you unhappy about?!= ?" > > Maybe you are not using email a lot, but for just about everyone who doe= s... > We have heard that. Many, many times. From many sources - spammers, > "legitimate" companies' marketing departments, etc. > > And you keep moving along the same track - the usual reaction of some > company after having pulled back a bloody stump and enjoyed the pile of > explanations of the reasons why opt-out is *NOT* *ACCEPTABLE*, *EVER* > is along the lines of "OK, we'll just spam everyone in our database once > and ask them to opt-in - that must be OK, right?" Being on bugzilla does _not_ mean you'll receive a single email unless someone _specifically_ CC's you. (Except for relevant mailing lists and already specified maintainers who are confirmed to manage certain kernel subsystems). We've had over40 messages in this conversation and not a single person has complained about SPAM ever coming from bugzilla. With what I proposed that would _not_ change. Weird to read this torrent of hatred and aggression towards purely imaginary SPAM. Anyways, Bugzilla is bad but it surely works. Let's have 100+ more interchanges inventing something most users (for whom Bugzilla exists - which people here keep forgetting all the time) will a have hard time working with. I repeat: Bugzilla exists for end users primarily. Regards, Artem