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[71.191.243.150]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id af79cd13be357-8db0d85a237sm391985285a.5.2026.04.09.07.10.53 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Thu, 09 Apr 2026 07:10:54 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 9 Apr 2026 10:10:52 -0400 From: Gregory Price To: Ritesh Harjani Cc: "Huang, Ying" , Donet Tom , David Hildenbrand , Andrew Morton , Ingo Molnar , Peter Zijlstra , linux-mm@kvack.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, Baolin Wang , Ying Huang , Juri Lelli , Mel Gorman Subject: Re: [PATCH v2] memory tiering: Do not allow promotion if NUMA_BALANCING_MEMORY_TIERING is disabled Message-ID: References: <20260323094849.3903-1-donettom@linux.ibm.com> <87wlyqt52m.fsf@DESKTOP-5N7EMDA> <87o6k1ubg4.fsf@DESKTOP-5N7EMDA> <877bqgvs4k.fsf@DESKTOP-5N7EMDA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Rspam-User: X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: DFED2140009 X-Stat-Signature: f3zd8e4x7p55xncam9j837ai3nqyaatc X-Rspamd-Server: rspam06 X-HE-Tag: 1775743855-226658 X-HE-Meta: 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 STv4zOhK e8eeUmrWTjY0mwLX3f3+XAZHtva+nG4MKKqPi8cFozLJJkSIBYkB0x7aYPhw1Z1lmt/uZtKuD3Vn3bxsHBVe+8Y4geeo9zGBN1TUFeVg2sfSfg+kiICj7p7ziYbf4RYUcXuXfH2zwlQEqXx7Z6/iIQmQqI+qha2mELs84g5WHVz/+AKNQSFFaZROrR7MOiirjFHRG4dhchimF8roAWFGlPb8/rIQvHp0e83rbRCj9mVHGezDPyqI9GYo4N/OyUux28c8E0B/vcZPwA8cYf7GC4UEbYD0w1KHp+6j0n3di8gUyeEPI3NblnA8veZlIGLC5xpK05nTyAlVQoX9IGETi22Sty8oB3X047ZEHOxBBvNx2TwukuUQ1nOpaKuzQxRDf0nJxArpB1HVvBgp3CZf+c7rmaMmi8QOQfNcW35Md/Amdhce2sqsdAwa3HH1KqJh743YFQjGqlVVi0rr2lzbikTBTzGFnwSMQeayWSbIfdB2fFbM= Sender: owner-linux-mm@kvack.org Precedence: bulk X-Loop: owner-majordomo@kvack.org List-ID: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: On Thu, Apr 09, 2026 at 09:12:56AM +0530, Ritesh Harjani wrote: > "Huang, Ying" writes: > > >>>>> Donet Tom writes: > >> > >> > >> Thanks for the clarification. I was running some experiments where I > >> only required migration, not promotion. However, I observed that > >> promotion was still occurring even when NUMA_BALANCING_MEMORY_TIERING > >> was disabled, which led me to believe it might be a bug, so I reported > >> it. > >> > >> As I understand it, enabling both NUMA_BALANCING_MEMORY_TIERING and > >> NUMA_BALANCING_NORMAL results in both promotion and migration. Given > >> this, do you see any concerns with modifying the behavior of > >> NUMA_BALANCING_NORMAL? > >> > >> With this patch, we would have better control over enabling and > >> disabling promotion independently. I would appreciate your thoughts on > >> this. > > > > IIUC, we change the existing user visible behavior only with strong > > enough practical reason. > > So what I understood from this discussion so far is, we don't have any > mechanism to do auto-numa base page migration between DRAM -to- DRAM w/o > triggering promotions too from a lower tiers to higher tiers. > > ... This to me sounds more like a broken interface. > It only seems that way because the naming suggests tiering did not exist prior to _TIERING - instead _NORMAL just operates in a suboptimal manner when multiple tiers exist. _NORMAL migrates a page when it detects the node it's on is not the local node of the task doing the work. _TIERING takes into account the liveliness of the pages with a timestamp. Going to agree with Ying here - this change should be dropped without additional data. If you can show _NORMAL would be better off not moving low-tier pages for at least a handful of common benchmarks, or that _NORMAL is causes incorrect placement - then I think this change is warranted. But as it is, this would just be a behavioral change without supporting data to justify it. ~Gregory