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From: Mircea CIRJALIU - MELIU <mcirjaliu@bitdefender.com>
To: Jason Gunthorpe <jgg@ziepe.ca>
Cc: "Adalbert Lazăr" <alazar@bitdefender.com>,
	"linux-mm@kvack.org" <linux-mm@kvack.org>,
	"linux-api@vger.kernel.org" <linux-api@vger.kernel.org>,
	"Andrew Morton" <akpm@linux-foundation.org>,
	"Alexander Graf" <graf@amazon.com>,
	"Stefan Hajnoczi" <stefanha@redhat.com>,
	"Jerome Glisse" <jglisse@redhat.com>,
	"Paolo Bonzini" <pbonzini@redhat.com>,
	"Mihai Donțu" <mdontu@bitdefender.com>,
	"Andy Lutomirski" <luto@kernel.org>,
	"Arnd Bergmann" <arnd@arndb.de>,
	"Sargun Dhillon" <sargun@sargun.me>,
	"Aleksa Sarai" <cyphar@cyphar.com>,
	"Oleg Nesterov" <oleg@redhat.com>, "Jann Horn" <jannh@google.com>,
	"Kees Cook" <keescook@chromium.org>,
	"Matthew Wilcox" <willy@infradead.org>,
	"Christian Brauner" <christian.brauner@ubuntu.com>
Subject: RE: [RESEND RFC PATCH 0/5] Remote mapping
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 2020 15:40:55 +0000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <AM7PR02MB6082C74BEE8285D242F3A03CBB2D0@AM7PR02MB6082.eurprd02.prod.outlook.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20200904143903.GT24045@ziepe.ca>

> On Fri, Sep 04, 2020 at 02:18:37PM +0000, Mircea CIRJALIU - MELIU wrote:
> > > This seems really sketchy, get_user_pages is sensitive to the VMA,
> > > what happens when VMA flags are different/etc?
> >
> > A debugger shouldn't complain if a portion of the debuggee is
> > read-only, just overwrite the data.
> 
> At this point the kernel API here is so incredibly limited you may as well use a
> memfd for passing the shared address space instead of trying to do and
> maintain this complexity.
> 
> Your use case is only qemu, so what is the problem to replace the allocator
> backing VM memory in userspace? Other people have been talking about
> doing a memfd already for different reasons - and memfd can already be
> shared as this scheme desires.

KSM doesn't work on shmem.
Once you replace the allocator you render KSM useless.

Besides that, I had a mail once from Paolo Bonzini:
>> Hi,
>>
>> here at FOSDEM we discussed having a way for a parent process to 
>> split parts of an mmap range with one or more child processes.  This 
>> turns out to be a generalization of the remote memory mapping concept 
>> that BitDefender proposed for virtual machine introspection ( 
>> https://patchwork.kernel.org/patch/11284561/).  So far the patches 
>> haven't had a great reception from the MM people, but it shouldn't be 
>> hard to adjust the API according to the sketch below.  I am also 
>> including Mircea who is the author.
>>
>> The proposed API is a new pidfd system call, through which the parent 
>> can map portions of its virtual address space into a file descriptor 
>> and then pass that file descriptor to a child.
(the rest can be found in the cover letter)

Therefore I had to do a module that peeks into anon process memory.
And be compatible with KSM. This was among the requirements for the first
version of remote mapping, which ended up non-scalable.

Figures out it can peek into any kind of memory involving pages.
Also it doesn't have the overhead associated with mapping a page in a VMA.
And compared to ptrace(), it can keep the pages resident as long as needed.

Mircea

  reply	other threads:[~2020-09-04 15:41 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 44+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2020-09-04 11:31 Adalbert Lazăr
2020-09-04 11:31 ` [RESEND RFC PATCH 1/5] mm: add atomic capability to zap_details Adalbert Lazăr
2020-09-04 11:31 ` [RESEND RFC PATCH 2/5] mm: let the VMA decide how zap_pte_range() acts on mapped pages Adalbert Lazăr
2020-09-04 11:31 ` [RESEND RFC PATCH 3/5] mm/mmu_notifier: remove lockdep map, allow mmu notifier to be used in nested scenarios Adalbert Lazăr
2020-09-04 12:03   ` Jason Gunthorpe
2020-09-04 11:31 ` [RESEND RFC PATCH 4/5] mm/remote_mapping: use a pidfd to access memory belonging to unrelated process Adalbert Lazăr
2020-09-04 17:55   ` Oleg Nesterov
2020-09-07 14:30   ` Oleg Nesterov
2020-09-07 15:16     ` Adalbert Lazăr
2020-09-09  8:32     ` Mircea CIRJALIU - MELIU
2020-09-10 16:43       ` Oleg Nesterov
2020-09-07 15:02   ` Christian Brauner
2020-09-07 16:04     ` Mircea CIRJALIU - MELIU
2020-09-04 11:31 ` [RESEND RFC PATCH 5/5] pidfd_mem: implemented remote memory mapping system call Adalbert Lazăr
2020-09-04 19:18   ` Florian Weimer
2020-09-07 14:55   ` Christian Brauner
2020-09-04 12:11 ` [RESEND RFC PATCH 0/5] Remote mapping Jason Gunthorpe
2020-09-04 13:24   ` Mircea CIRJALIU - MELIU
2020-09-04 13:39     ` Jason Gunthorpe
2020-09-04 14:18       ` Mircea CIRJALIU - MELIU
2020-09-04 14:39         ` Jason Gunthorpe
2020-09-04 15:40           ` Mircea CIRJALIU - MELIU [this message]
2020-09-04 16:11             ` Jason Gunthorpe
2020-09-04 19:41   ` Matthew Wilcox
2020-09-04 19:49     ` Jason Gunthorpe
2020-09-04 20:08     ` Paolo Bonzini
2020-12-01 18:01     ` Jason Gunthorpe
2020-09-04 19:19 ` Florian Weimer
2020-09-04 20:18   ` Paolo Bonzini
2020-09-07  8:33     ` Christian Brauner
2020-09-04 19:39 ` Andy Lutomirski
2020-09-04 20:09   ` Paolo Bonzini
2020-09-04 20:34     ` Andy Lutomirski
2020-09-04 21:58       ` Paolo Bonzini
2020-09-04 23:17         ` Andy Lutomirski
2020-09-05 18:27           ` Paolo Bonzini
2020-09-07  8:38             ` Christian Brauner
2020-09-07 12:41           ` Mircea CIRJALIU - MELIU
2020-09-07  7:05         ` Christoph Hellwig
2020-09-07  8:44           ` Paolo Bonzini
2020-09-07 10:25   ` Mircea CIRJALIU - MELIU
2020-09-07 15:05 ` Christian Brauner
2020-09-07 20:43   ` Andy Lutomirski
2020-09-09 11:38     ` Stefan Hajnoczi

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