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([2a09:80c0:192:0:5dac:bf3d:c41:c3e7]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 5b1f17b1804b1-4327d5c6623sm151386035e9.20.2024.11.04.04.32.55 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 04 Nov 2024 04:32:56 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3f943f72-59d6-4124-96b2-e0bb8d7a5ebd@redhat.com> Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2024 13:32:55 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: [PATCH v2] mm: count zeromap read and set for swapout and swapin To: Barry Song <21cnbao@gmail.com>, Usama Arif Cc: akpm@linux-foundation.org, linux-mm@kvack.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, Barry Song , Chengming Zhou , Yosry Ahmed , Nhat Pham , Johannes Weiner , Hugh Dickins , Matthew Wilcox , Shakeel Butt , Andi Kleen , Baolin Wang , Chris Li , "Huang, Ying" , Kairui Song , Ryan Roberts References: <20241102101240.35072-1-21cnbao@gmail.com> <6c14ab2c-7917-489b-b51e-401d208067f3@gmail.com> From: David Hildenbrand Autocrypt: addr=david@redhat.com; keydata= xsFNBFXLn5EBEAC+zYvAFJxCBY9Tr1xZgcESmxVNI/0ffzE/ZQOiHJl6mGkmA1R7/uUpiCjJ dBrn+lhhOYjjNefFQou6478faXE6o2AhmebqT4KiQoUQFV4R7y1KMEKoSyy8hQaK1umALTdL QZLQMzNE74ap+GDK0wnacPQFpcG1AE9RMq3aeErY5tujekBS32jfC/7AnH7I0v1v1TbbK3Gp XNeiN4QroO+5qaSr0ID2sz5jtBLRb15RMre27E1ImpaIv2Jw8NJgW0k/D1RyKCwaTsgRdwuK Kx/Y91XuSBdz0uOyU/S8kM1+ag0wvsGlpBVxRR/xw/E8M7TEwuCZQArqqTCmkG6HGcXFT0V9 PXFNNgV5jXMQRwU0O/ztJIQqsE5LsUomE//bLwzj9IVsaQpKDqW6TAPjcdBDPLHvriq7kGjt WhVhdl0qEYB8lkBEU7V2Yb+SYhmhpDrti9Fq1EsmhiHSkxJcGREoMK/63r9WLZYI3+4W2rAc UucZa4OT27U5ZISjNg3Ev0rxU5UH2/pT4wJCfxwocmqaRr6UYmrtZmND89X0KigoFD/XSeVv jwBRNjPAubK9/k5NoRrYqztM9W6sJqrH8+UWZ1Idd/DdmogJh0gNC0+N42Za9yBRURfIdKSb B3JfpUqcWwE7vUaYrHG1nw54pLUoPG6sAA7Mehl3nd4pZUALHwARAQABzSREYXZpZCBIaWxk ZW5icmFuZCA8ZGF2aWRAcmVkaGF0LmNvbT7CwZgEEwEIAEICGwMGCwkIBwMCBhUIAgkKCwQW AgMBAh4BAheAAhkBFiEEG9nKrXNcTDpGDfzKTd4Q9wD/g1oFAl8Ox4kFCRKpKXgACgkQTd4Q 9wD/g1oHcA//a6Tj7SBNjFNM1iNhWUo1lxAja0lpSodSnB2g4FCZ4R61SBR4l/psBL73xktp rDHrx4aSpwkRP6Epu6mLvhlfjmkRG4OynJ5HG1gfv7RJJfnUdUM1z5kdS8JBrOhMJS2c/gPf wv1TGRq2XdMPnfY2o0CxRqpcLkx4vBODvJGl2mQyJF/gPepdDfcT8/PY9BJ7FL6Hrq1gnAo4 3Iv9qV0JiT2wmZciNyYQhmA1V6dyTRiQ4YAc31zOo2IM+xisPzeSHgw3ONY/XhYvfZ9r7W1l pNQdc2G+o4Di9NPFHQQhDw3YTRR1opJaTlRDzxYxzU6ZnUUBghxt9cwUWTpfCktkMZiPSDGd KgQBjnweV2jw9UOTxjb4LXqDjmSNkjDdQUOU69jGMUXgihvo4zhYcMX8F5gWdRtMR7DzW/YE BgVcyxNkMIXoY1aYj6npHYiNQesQlqjU6azjbH70/SXKM5tNRplgW8TNprMDuntdvV9wNkFs 9TyM02V5aWxFfI42+aivc4KEw69SE9KXwC7FSf5wXzuTot97N9Phj/Z3+jx443jo2NR34XgF 89cct7wJMjOF7bBefo0fPPZQuIma0Zym71cP61OP/i11ahNye6HGKfxGCOcs5wW9kRQEk8P9 M/k2wt3mt/fCQnuP/mWutNPt95w9wSsUyATLmtNrwccz63XOwU0EVcufkQEQAOfX3n0g0fZz Bgm/S2zF/kxQKCEKP8ID+Vz8sy2GpDvveBq4H2Y34XWsT1zLJdvqPI4af4ZSMxuerWjXbVWb T6d4odQIG0fKx4F8NccDqbgHeZRNajXeeJ3R7gAzvWvQNLz4piHrO/B4tf8svmRBL0ZB5P5A 2uhdwLU3NZuK22zpNn4is87BPWF8HhY0L5fafgDMOqnf4guJVJPYNPhUFzXUbPqOKOkL8ojk CXxkOFHAbjstSK5Ca3fKquY3rdX3DNo+EL7FvAiw1mUtS+5GeYE+RMnDCsVFm/C7kY8c2d0G NWkB9pJM5+mnIoFNxy7YBcldYATVeOHoY4LyaUWNnAvFYWp08dHWfZo9WCiJMuTfgtH9tc75 7QanMVdPt6fDK8UUXIBLQ2TWr/sQKE9xtFuEmoQGlE1l6bGaDnnMLcYu+Asp3kDT0w4zYGsx 5r6XQVRH4+5N6eHZiaeYtFOujp5n+pjBaQK7wUUjDilPQ5QMzIuCL4YjVoylWiBNknvQWBXS lQCWmavOT9sttGQXdPCC5ynI+1ymZC1ORZKANLnRAb0NH/UCzcsstw2TAkFnMEbo9Zu9w7Kv AxBQXWeXhJI9XQssfrf4Gusdqx8nPEpfOqCtbbwJMATbHyqLt7/oz/5deGuwxgb65pWIzufa N7eop7uh+6bezi+rugUI+w6DABEBAAHCwXwEGAEIACYCGwwWIQQb2cqtc1xMOkYN/MpN3hD3 AP+DWgUCXw7HsgUJEqkpoQAKCRBN3hD3AP+DWrrpD/4qS3dyVRxDcDHIlmguXjC1Q5tZTwNB boaBTPHSy/Nksu0eY7x6HfQJ3xajVH32Ms6t1trDQmPx2iP5+7iDsb7OKAb5eOS8h+BEBDeq 3ecsQDv0fFJOA9ag5O3LLNk+3x3q7e0uo06XMaY7UHS341ozXUUI7wC7iKfoUTv03iO9El5f XpNMx/YrIMduZ2+nd9Di7o5+KIwlb2mAB9sTNHdMrXesX8eBL6T9b+MZJk+mZuPxKNVfEQMQ a5SxUEADIPQTPNvBewdeI80yeOCrN+Zzwy/Mrx9EPeu59Y5vSJOx/z6OUImD/GhX7Xvkt3kq Er5KTrJz3++B6SH9pum9PuoE/k+nntJkNMmQpR4MCBaV/J9gIOPGodDKnjdng+mXliF3Ptu6 3oxc2RCyGzTlxyMwuc2U5Q7KtUNTdDe8T0uE+9b8BLMVQDDfJjqY0VVqSUwImzTDLX9S4g/8 kC4HRcclk8hpyhY2jKGluZO0awwTIMgVEzmTyBphDg/Gx7dZU1Xf8HFuE+UZ5UDHDTnwgv7E th6RC9+WrhDNspZ9fJjKWRbveQgUFCpe1sa77LAw+XFrKmBHXp9ZVIe90RMe2tRL06BGiRZr jPrnvUsUUsjRoRNJjKKA/REq+sAnhkNPPZ/NNMjaZ5b8Tovi8C0tmxiCHaQYqj7G2rgnT0kt WNyWQQ== Organization: Red Hat In-Reply-To: X-Mimecast-Spam-Score: 0 X-Mimecast-Originator: redhat.com Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; 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However, it’s easy >>> to construct a scenario where this becomes an issue—for example, >>> allocating 1 GB of memory, writing zeros from userspace, followed by >>> MADV_PAGEOUT, and then swapping it back in. In this case, the swap-out >>> and swap-in counts seem to vanish into a black hole, potentially >>> causing semantic ambiguity. >>> >>> We have two ways to address this: >>> >>> 1. Add a separate counter specifically for the zero map. >>> 2. Continue using the current accounting, treating the zero map like >>> a normal backend. (This aligns with the current behavior of zRAM >>> when supporting same-page fills at the device level.) >>> >>> This patch adopts option 1 as pswpin/pswpout counters are that they >>> only apply to IO done directly to the backend device (as noted by >>> Nhat Pham). >>> >>> We can find these counters from /proc/vmstat (counters for the whole >>> system) and memcg's memory.stat (counters for the interested memcg). >>> >>> For example: >>> >>> $ grep -E 'swpin_zero|swpout_zero' /proc/vmstat >>> swpin_zero 1648 >>> swpout_zero 33536 >>> >>> $ grep -E 'swpin_zero|swpout_zero' /sys/fs/cgroup/system.slice/memory.stat >>> swpin_zero 3905 >>> swpout_zero 3985 >>> >>> Fixes: 0ca0c24e3211 ("mm: store zero pages to be swapped out in a bitmap") >> I don't think its a hotfix (or even a fix). It was discussed in the initial >> series to add these as a follow up and Joshua was going to do this soon. >> Its not fixing any bug in the initial series. > > I would prefer that all kernel versions with zeromap include this > counter; otherwise, > it could be confusing to determine where swap-in and swap-out have occurred, > as shown by the small program below: > > p =malloc(1g); > write p to zero > madvise_pageout > read p; > > Previously, there was 1GB of swap-in and swap-out activity reported, but > now nothing is shown. > > I don't mean to suggest that there's a bug in the zeromap code; rather, > having this counter would help clear up any confusion. > > I didn't realize Joshua was handling it. Is he still planning to? If > so, I can leave it > with Joshua if that was the plan :-) > >> >>> Cc: Usama Arif >>> Cc: Chengming Zhou >>> Cc: Yosry Ahmed >>> Cc: Nhat Pham >>> Cc: Johannes Weiner >>> Cc: David Hildenbrand >>> Cc: Hugh Dickins >>> Cc: Matthew Wilcox (Oracle) >>> Cc: Shakeel Butt >>> Cc: Andi Kleen >>> Cc: Baolin Wang >>> Cc: Chris Li >>> Cc: "Huang, Ying" >>> Cc: Kairui Song >>> Cc: Ryan Roberts >>> Signed-off-by: Barry Song >>> --- >>> -v2: >>> * add separate counters rather than using pswpin/out; thanks >>> for the comments from Usama, David, Yosry and Nhat; >>> * Usama also suggested a new counter like swapped_zero, I >>> prefer that one be separated as an enhancement patch not >>> a hotfix. will probably handle it later on. >>> >> I dont think either of them would be a hotfix. > > As mentioned above, this isn't about fixing a bug; it's simply to ensure > that swap-related metrics don't disappear. Documentation/process/submitting-patches.rst: "A Fixes: tag indicates that the patch fixes an issue in a previous commit. It is used to make it easy to determine where a bug originated, which can help review a bug fix." If there is no BUG, I'm afraid you are abusing that tag. Also, I don't really understand the problem? We added an optimization, great. Who will be complaining about that? Above you write "it could be confusing to determine where swap-in and swap-out have occurred" -- when is that confusion supposed to happen in practice? How will the confused individuals know that they must take a look at that new metric, even if it is in place? I think we should just add the new stats and call it a day. -- Cheers, David / dhildenb