From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org Received: from kanga.kvack.org (kanga.kvack.org [205.233.56.17]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FE54C4828D for ; Fri, 2 Feb 2024 01:06:08 +0000 (UTC) Received: by kanga.kvack.org (Postfix) id 0DCE56B0075; Thu, 1 Feb 2024 20:06:08 -0500 (EST) Received: by kanga.kvack.org (Postfix, from userid 40) id 08E696B0078; Thu, 1 Feb 2024 20:06:08 -0500 (EST) X-Delivered-To: int-list-linux-mm@kvack.org Received: by kanga.kvack.org (Postfix, from userid 63042) id E97716B007B; Thu, 1 Feb 2024 20:06:07 -0500 (EST) X-Delivered-To: linux-mm@kvack.org Received: from relay.hostedemail.com (smtprelay0012.hostedemail.com [216.40.44.12]) by kanga.kvack.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D67436B0075 for ; Thu, 1 Feb 2024 20:06:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtpin21.hostedemail.com (a10.router.float.18 [10.200.18.1]) by unirelay05.hostedemail.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9BDD940E7A for ; Fri, 2 Feb 2024 01:06:07 +0000 (UTC) X-FDA: 81745072374.21.9FBA41F Received: from dfw.source.kernel.org (dfw.source.kernel.org [139.178.84.217]) by imf26.hostedemail.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC1BF140002 for ; Fri, 2 Feb 2024 01:06:05 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: imf26.hostedemail.com; dkim=pass header.d=linuxfoundation.org header.s=korg header.b=esiuD9iU; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=linuxfoundation.org; spf=pass (imf26.hostedemail.com: domain of gregkh@linuxfoundation.org designates 139.178.84.217 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=gregkh@linuxfoundation.org ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=hostedemail.com; s=arc-20220608; t=1706835966; h=from:from:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:dkim-signature; bh=pN58hUxorIT9hIDxbIZfSVcPSnoxnBvx6xtgLj2kTJc=; b=KaYcg8WSMtRPeDD4iRYsM/90sApFgOrTuPfSVjm44syRzBIZH/N1X2wj1sCZa3S5fC2LzW y8M3TXtxEFwXf7fxAjdddnFnOtJTVd+tbg+oFOjiSz1tqeBVqpoHWq7kdxl+uBpPRRUr8y 5sVCfgzWCJRrzh4NFzDInBvyppfKJ/Q= ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; imf26.hostedemail.com; dkim=pass header.d=linuxfoundation.org header.s=korg header.b=esiuD9iU; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=linuxfoundation.org; spf=pass (imf26.hostedemail.com: domain of gregkh@linuxfoundation.org designates 139.178.84.217 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=gregkh@linuxfoundation.org ARC-Seal: i=1; s=arc-20220608; d=hostedemail.com; t=1706835966; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=L+BmYNu91eFEN2d1ouHasUzvSs3wSccyoP5dA7ZRgaRfV1SgBvV60pUhHhxNYmtRvf+23U VD5jujVg6CE4epHzhIzbzzO2oBop6HEJdRi/DRrecRMiBeTmhI5/Ij4br67Ir5qmcEohmg qVyZEOzPbRN50B7RrFa1worY+gKMA+g= Received: from smtp.kernel.org (transwarp.subspace.kernel.org [100.75.92.58]) by dfw.source.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A58C362243; Fri, 2 Feb 2024 01:06:04 +0000 (UTC) Received: by smtp.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3FC09C433C7; Fri, 2 Feb 2024 01:06:04 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=linuxfoundation.org; s=korg; t=1706835964; bh=FCd8HoHZrcX63bQlMAlSTqIPH/4qdHcUl1FKM5j5vsA=; h=Date:From:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:From; b=esiuD9iU7YeWm66qZS9sotr0oscjl9KHVUZ0JvRlbyJyTgwZ2DAHvReTGSJj8Exwk QsMvI06Zan9QzIH7ULW++Jl5sWbQROYd2EqWQtOwbm7OmDIp7qWO3e04fRioc4jaFG n2kFJpJUOY92viQr7+kBMQwQD7oBQXt6boqi7cEc= Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2024 17:06:03 -0800 From: Greg KH To: "Liam R. Howlett" , Jeff Xu , Jonathan Corbet , akpm@linux-foundation.org, keescook@chromium.org, jannh@google.com, sroettger@google.com, willy@infradead.org, torvalds@linux-foundation.org, usama.anjum@collabora.com, rdunlap@infradead.org, jeffxu@google.com, jorgelo@chromium.org, groeck@chromium.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, linux-kselftest@vger.kernel.org, linux-mm@kvack.org, pedro.falcato@gmail.com, dave.hansen@intel.com, linux-hardening@vger.kernel.org Subject: Re: [PATCH v8 0/4] Introduce mseal Message-ID: <2024020137-hacking-tightwad-a485@gregkh> References: <20240131175027.3287009-1-jeffxu@chromium.org> <20240131193411.opisg5yoyxkwoyil@revolver> <20240201204512.ht3e33yj77kkxi4q@revolver> <60731.1706826280@cvs.openbsd.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <60731.1706826280@cvs.openbsd.org> X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: CC1BF140002 X-Rspam-User: X-Rspamd-Server: rspam02 X-Stat-Signature: zre4tt8a4j7ndai6h7w716dn6kjk1h4m X-HE-Tag: 1706835965-431085 X-HE-Meta: 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 +LVHLee6 fRFI8r8ghKT086D9xj518FoA0WVzemzOV40QoofYzOCGIza3Q7H21V5jwXMKq12Slun5KWHK+6nbqjmy/oUOfnlVEvWuj92D7yECExZWqtFBTvOwv0q3meTn+cQCEOZtgeemDfAgRuMSuxirlDInCCCjUGjYduQwGVRZ+a6+2D/JaAFdVDrIRIeSMca3Hc3UXHhpimR5q342wW479rEf9rK8J9Bna8HRHstJsb94+ipL49lndDX9TRq/LJxwBIIaBgdtnvKgiW+FN2imQUtA0qqTBMJDUzdT451LO X-Bogosity: Ham, tests=bogofilter, spamicity=0.000000, version=1.2.4 Sender: owner-linux-mm@kvack.org Precedence: bulk X-Loop: owner-majordomo@kvack.org List-ID: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: On Thu, Feb 01, 2024 at 03:24:40PM -0700, Theo de Raadt wrote: > As an outsider, Linux development is really strange: > > Two sub-features are being pushed very hard, and the primary developer > doesn't have code which uses either of them. And once it goes in, it > cannot be changed. > > It's very different from my world, where the absolutely minimal > interface was written to apply to a whole operating system plus 10,000+ > applications, and then took months of testing before it was approved for > inclusion. And if it was subtly wrong, we would be able to change it. No, it's this "feature" submission that is strange to think that we don't need that. We do need, and will require, an actual working userspace something to use it, otherwise as you say, there's no way to actually know if it works properly or not and we can't change it once we accept it. So along those lines, Jeff, do you have a pointer to the Chrome patches, or glibc patches, that use this new interface that proves that it actually works? Those would be great to see to at least verify it's been tested in a real-world situation and actually works for your use case. thanks, greg k-h