From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (smtp1.linux-foundation.org [172.17.192.35]) by mail.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6A20EB3F for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2017 18:59:42 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-it0-f67.google.com (mail-it0-f67.google.com [209.85.214.67]) by smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DBCA21A8 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2017 18:59:38 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-it0-f67.google.com with SMTP id 193so99367itm.1 for ; Tue, 18 Apr 2017 11:59:38 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: linus971@gmail.com From: Linus Torvalds Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2017 11:59:37 -0700 Message-ID: To: ksummit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Cc: Ingo Molnar , Dave Airlie , Greg Kroah-Hartman , Doug Ledford , David Miller Subject: [Ksummit-discuss] "Maintainer summit" invitation discussion List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , The kernel summit is apparently in October, and I promised last year to at least get the ball rolling with the people *I* would like to see. I even subscribed to this list, though I promised myself I wouldn't get involved in any other discussion. I've actually churned the numbers several ways, none of which really make me convinced that metric matters much. Looking at actual developers (actually, I generally just did "committers" rather than actual "authors"), you can certainly just do it by number of commits (or sizes of commits, or numbers of files touched), all of which I tried, and all of which actually got fairly similar "top 20" lists. And none of those "top 20" lists looked precisely wrong, but they didn't look precisely right either. So being in the quiet "late rc" period, I decided to try to just do statistics over who I pull from, and how much I pull instead. Which is much closer to that "maintainer summit" I think I want. And the end result actually looks not unreasonable when I do that. I ended up approximating the sorting by "cumulative files changed" (ie just counting number of files changed for each pull request I do: so the same file will count N times if it shows up in N pull requests). Like all the other metrics I tried, it does end up skewing one way or the other: people who touch a lot of files in trivial ways get counted more, but looking at the list I don't see anything really odd anywhere. In particular, with that metric I get the obvious two top maintainers being David Miller and Greg KH - which would be pretty much a requirement for any sane maintainership counting algorithm. The tip and arm maintainers also show up, although they obviously get diluted by spreading out their work. You can see the "top 10" list by just looking at the Cc of this email. That one looks sane too, and contains the main architectures (x86, arm, powerpc) and the biggest driver subsystems (drm, media, sound and rdma). And Andrew Morton. None of the filesystem people show up in the top 10, although Al does show up at spot 11, and individual filesystems show up lower down the list (mainly just xfs and ext4). What I _would_ like to see is those top maintainers suggest "submaintainer" names. Particularly Davem, since he doesn't tend to want to come to the kernel summit, and being at the top of the list that's a kind of big gaping hole. I guess we haven't had all that many _problems_ within networking, but if we talk maintainership issues, it's certainly a bit odd if it's entirely lacking. We have both core networking and network drivers that both fall under "davem" as far as my pull statistics go. I'm appending the "top 50" list in its entirely for people to look at - the numbers are the "cumulative files changed in pull requests _directly_ to me over the last 12 months". I'm not saying these people all make sense: I think we should also take other issues into account, and in particular rather than just a fairly straightforward "size of subsystem" it should be about maintenance burden size too. So drm and rdma both show up fairly high on both of those lists, I think, and thus should be part of any maintainership discussion - but maybe some other subsystems just aren't enough of a maintenance headache to worry about? So the other way to split it up is by "maintenance area", ie we have - architectures Pretty much covered by x86, arm, powerpc, and those architectures should talk about who within the group would attend. - drivers Obviously we have Greg overall, with drm and rdma because of issues. An example here is that Christoph doesn't show up because I don't generally pull from him, but he's been all over and often crosses multiple driver subsystems, and has been involved in rdma too, so I'd add him just for that. Some driver subsystems may be huge (eg media and sound), but I don't know if they have issues. Mauro/Takashi? - filesystems Al, XSF and ext4 stand out by size (XFS is mostly Dave Chinner due to me going by past year, but is obviously Darrick Wong right now). - core stuff. We've got Andrew, and I'd add Tejun from the list, with others possible? Maintenance issues here are actually sometimes contentious even if the core kernel is fairly small. - security stuff Luto, Kees? - particular pain points. Any not mentioned? - other? I'd like the maintainership summit list to be fairly small. Not even 50 people. Maybe 30. A group that can actually sit in a room for half a day and talk to each other about the issues they have rather than being talked to. And talk literally about *process* issues, not about any particular technical issues within whatever subsystem. Bring up peeves or wishes for actual process improvements? Comments? People who should be involved? Or people who don't have any particular issues and want to not be involved? Linus ----- 11118 David Miller 6004 Greg KH 5337 Dave Airlie 5114 Ingo Molnar 3918 Mauro Carvalho Chehab 3381 Arnd Bergmann 3096 Andrew Morton 1803 Michael Ellerman 1557 Takashi Iwai 1414 Doug Ledford 1341 Al Viro 1304 Rafael Wysocki 1233 Jens Axboe 1221 Thomas Gleixner 1045 Olof Johansson 980 Linus Walleij 924 James Bottomley 792 Ralf Baechle 788 Herbert Xu 751 Stephen Boyd 593 Martin Schwidefsky 585 Jonathan Corbet 529 Paolo Bonzini 443 Ulf Hansson 443 Bjorn Helgaas 421 Chris Mason 420 Mark Brown 411 Dave Chinner 410 James Morris 399 Michal Marek 383 Dmitry Torokhov 361 Will Deacon 353 Wolfram Sang 320 Jiri Kosina 310 Vineet Gupta 299 Russell King 298 Brian Norris 285 Lee Jones 280 Guenter Roeck 279 Vinod Koul 275 Rob Herring 271 Radim Kr=C4=8Dm=C3=A1=C5=99 266 James Hogan 251 Alexandre Belloni 239 Sebastian Reichel 221 Ted Ts'o 220 Tejun Heo 215 Dan Williams 210 Shuah Khan 208 Catalin Marinas