From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from mail.fsf.org (mail.fsf.org [209.51.188.13]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.subspace.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4A858612D; Thu, 9 Nov 2023 05:01:02 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dmarc=pass (p=none dis=none) header.from=fsf.org Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=fsf.org Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=fsf.org header.i=@fsf.org header.b="xXzJaG+7" DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=fsf.org; s=mail-fsf-org; h=MIME-Version:In-reply-to:Date:Subject:To:From:References; bh=+peS4VBY4EGWor8h12YXS9AConj23+2mTwIf7zUaVeA=; b=xXzJaG+77GHXS66K6QyOxC23e BX8LK2Tk3eAFo02Ba+l1qXHmAQvfsbt5EqnUtBMu8vkrRia49/AAP2HpYACB0YN98WiwUncHAZvIa 7aziZtoRjnDB72XT30LL7R/TrTDTQaJ9O6LB4RQwKQLmvpmJlfCQ9PLjkQ0MQixe+9RLl2vioLDvY bFoWceH+poa7lj0yKcnW0ZG3ZVlFa7GIhjzgu4cGFleGajz0wBnRpeK5VNA2/T1ED5E0vCh8KncaP DxAcPxjnxoGWacTg6JdFmQe5tsqXD7Ct3yxDP96bAwQBBP833CajQqYMTMmZMOiQBI4jmF/C8HPfG 4FVmBI8+Q==; References: <20231106-venomous-raccoon-of-wealth-acc57c@nitro> <87r0l2yi7v.fsf@email.froward.int.ebiederm.org> <20231106-mega-albatross-of-beauty-f2a7e9@meerkat> User-agent: mu4e 1.10.3; emacs 30.0.50 From: Ian Kelling To: Konstantin Ryabitsev Cc: Christoph Hellwig , "Eric W. Biederman" , users@linux.kernel.org, ksummit@lists.linux.dev Subject: Re: RFC: switching "THE REST" in MAINTAINERS away from linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2023 22:55:11 -0500 In-reply-to: <20231106-mega-albatross-of-beauty-f2a7e9@meerkat> Message-ID: <87pm0jmvbi.fsf@fsf.org> Precedence: bulk X-Mailing-List: ksummit@lists.linux.dev List-Id: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Konstantin Ryabitsev writes: > On Mon, Nov 06, 2023 at 09:05:12AM -0800, Christoph Hellwig wrote: >> How about restricting access to all lists for gmail addresses if gmail >> is so >> broken? > > Today it's gmail, tomorrow it's something else. Just a month ago all > services > using outlook.com were broken for days: > https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/answers/questions/1388775/outlook-com-servers-tells-server-busy-please-try-a > > All I want is to know is why someone wants to receive a copy of all > patches > via SMTP when much more effective mechanisms to achieve the same are > available. If someone can provide a valid reason -- such as being a > high-profile maintainer -- then of course I'll be happy to let them > subscribe. > > -K All kinds of services go down every day, smtp has good and bad, but I see no reason to think it should be deprecated or anything. For example, a good is that outgoing smtp is more resilient to ddos attacks than web servers. Part of being a sysadmin is that things keep breaking tomorrow and the next day, and we have to keep fixing them and it won't ever stop. Yes, sometimes migrating people to very different software is the fix, but I have experience running smtp at lists.gnu.org and from what I've read so far, I think the problems you've described can be effectively mitigated without restricting subscriptions nearly as much as you propose in a reasonable effort. I'd be happy to provide a bit of technical assistance. -- Ian Kelling | Senior Systems Administrator, Free Software Foundation GPG Key: B125 F60B 7B28 7FF6 A2B7 DF8F 170A F0E2 9542 95DF https://fsf.org | https://gnu.org