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From: Guenter Roeck <linux@roeck-us.net>
To: "Jason Cooper" <jason@lakedaemon.net>, "Peter Hüwe" <PeterHuewe@gmx.de>
Cc: Josh Boyer <jwboyer@fedoraproject.org>,
	ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org
Subject: Re: [Ksummit-discuss] [CORE TOPIC] Recruitment (Reviewers, Testers, Maintainers, Hobbyists)
Date: Wed, 08 Jul 2015 09:36:26 -0700	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <559D518A.7010304@roeck-us.net> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20150708150220.GJ23515@io.lakedaemon.net>

On 07/08/2015 08:02 AM, Jason Cooper wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 08, 2015 at 09:04:58AM +0200, Peter Hüwe wrote:

>> "I've been a kernel reviewer and tester" -- meh, who cares
>
> Show me a concrete example where that has been expressed.  I've had the
> exact opposite experience.  Typically I've had to tone down the
> expectations of others.
>
Lucky you.

In my experience, code reviews often don't get much attention by project
managers responsible for commercial projects. If anything, quite the opposite.
The Linux kernel development culture is quite different.

Linux kernel:
	"Thanks a lot for reviewing my code and making it better".
Commercial:
	"Why do your reviews always take such a long time ?
	You are holding up the release!"

Granted, that doesn't happen everywhere, but I have seen it more than once,
and I would content that this kind of culture is pretty widely spread.

Anyone entering such an environment might actually encounter negative
reactions to "I am a kernel reviewer and tester". Of course, one might
argue that joining an affected company might not be a good idea in the
first place, but not everyone has that much flexibility or choice.

I am not saying that it would be a bad idea to give code reviewers more
credit; quite the contrary. However, I think it would be wrong to assume
or expect that giving reviewers more credit would improve their chances
for employment. It would, however, result in reviewers feeling recognized
for themselves, which is a good thing.

Why does it matter ? I had a discussion a while ago with the founder of
one of the web sites providing product reviews. I suggested to give product
reviewers some kind of monetary reward for their reviews, eg part of the
advertising revenue created by the site. Feedback I got was that reviewers
typically don't care about monetary rewards, but they do care about recognition
and about their standing in the community.

Guenter

  reply	other threads:[~2015-07-08 16:36 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 359+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2015-07-07 23:21 Peter Huewe
2015-07-07 23:49 ` Laurent Pinchart
2015-07-08  0:50   ` Guenter Roeck
2015-07-08  1:40     ` NeilBrown
2015-07-08 19:45       ` Laurent Pinchart
2015-07-09 19:37         ` Darren Hart
2015-07-09 20:11           ` josh
2015-07-09 20:38             ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2015-07-09 21:00               ` josh
2015-07-09 21:03                 ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2015-07-09 21:42                   ` Luck, Tony
2015-07-11  8:32                   ` Fengguang Wu
2015-07-09 21:24                 ` Julia Lawall
2015-07-09 21:46                   ` David Woodhouse
2015-07-09 23:11                   ` josh
2015-07-09 23:30                     ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2015-07-09 23:35                     ` Julia Lawall
2015-07-09 23:49                       ` josh
2015-07-12 21:44                       ` Laurent Pinchart
2015-07-16  9:21                         ` David Woodhouse
2015-07-16  9:26                           ` James Bottomley
2015-07-16  9:39                             ` David Woodhouse
2015-07-16  9:38                           ` Peter Huewe
2015-07-11  4:34                     ` Fengguang Wu
2015-07-10  8:19                 ` Peter Huewe
2015-07-10 17:06                   ` Luck, Tony
2015-07-10  8:54                 ` James Bottomley
2015-07-12  2:02                   ` Fengguang Wu
2015-07-12  5:19                     ` Josh Triplett
2015-07-12  8:19                       ` James Bottomley
2015-07-12 10:48                         ` Fengguang Wu
2015-07-12 18:23                           ` Josh Triplett
2015-07-13 10:48                       ` Mark Brown
2015-07-10 15:32                 ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-10 16:32                   ` Josh Triplett
2015-07-09 20:43             ` Darren Hart
2015-08-03 12:38             ` Fengguang Wu
2015-08-05  7:48               ` Darren Hart
2015-08-05 23:16                 ` Fengguang Wu
2015-07-09 22:31           ` David Woodhouse
2015-07-09 23:08             ` Julia Lawall
2015-07-09 23:38             ` Darren Hart
2015-07-09 23:41               ` David Woodhouse
2015-07-09 23:59                 ` Theodore Ts'o
2015-07-10  0:55               ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2015-07-10  2:00                 ` Darren Hart
2015-07-10  0:35             ` Mark Brown
2015-07-10  2:07               ` Darren Hart
2015-07-10 12:44                 ` Jason Cooper
2015-07-10 18:24                   ` Mark Brown
2015-07-10 20:40                     ` josh
2015-07-13 10:00                       ` Mark Brown
2015-07-10 19:51                 ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-10 20:00                   ` David Woodhouse
2015-07-10 20:31                     ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-10 20:40                       ` David Woodhouse
2015-07-10 20:43                         ` Josh Boyer
2015-07-12 10:23                           ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2015-07-10 23:09                         ` Darren Hart
2015-07-10 23:37                           ` David Woodhouse
2015-07-10 23:54                             ` Darren Hart
2015-07-10 20:56                     ` josh
2015-07-10 21:03                       ` David Woodhouse
2015-07-10 21:07                         ` josh
2015-07-10 23:11                           ` Darren Hart
2015-07-12 10:28                           ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2015-07-12 18:22                             ` Josh Triplett
2015-07-10 23:01                     ` Darren Hart
2015-07-12 10:17                     ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2015-07-12 22:00                     ` Laurent Pinchart
2015-07-13 10:11                       ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2015-07-13 10:21                         ` Laurent Pinchart
2015-07-13 16:18                       ` Guenter Roeck
2015-07-13 17:59                         ` Jonathan Cameron
2015-07-14 15:31                       ` David Woodhouse
2015-07-14 17:05                         ` Jason Cooper
2015-07-10 20:03                   ` Tim Bird
2015-07-10 20:11                     ` Guenter
2015-07-10 20:54                   ` josh
2015-07-10 22:57                     ` Darren Hart
2015-07-11  0:00                     ` Dan Williams
2015-07-10 12:32             ` Jason Cooper
2015-07-10 15:54               ` Darren Hart
2015-07-10 16:22                 ` Jason Cooper
2015-07-10 14:36           ` Dan Carpenter
2015-07-10 16:07             ` Darren Hart
2015-07-10 22:23               ` Greg KH
2015-07-11  0:00                 ` Darren Hart
2015-07-11  0:13                   ` Greg KH
2015-07-11  2:39                     ` Darren Hart
2015-07-11 15:04                       ` Greg KH
2015-07-12 21:27                         ` Peter Hüwe
2015-07-14 23:58                           ` Darren Hart
2015-07-14  2:24                         ` Darren Hart
2015-07-11  5:54                     ` Sudip Mukherjee
2015-07-11 13:29                       ` Julia Lawall
2015-07-11 15:18                         ` Jason Cooper
2015-07-11 16:45                           ` Greg KH
2015-07-11 19:35                             ` Jason Cooper
2015-07-11 22:45                               ` Greg KH
2015-07-12  1:16                                 ` Jason Cooper
2015-07-16  1:20                       ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-16 13:25                         ` Mark Brown
2015-07-16 13:47                           ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-16 13:56                             ` Sudip Mukherjee
2015-07-16 15:03                               ` Mark Brown
2015-07-16 14:41                             ` Mark Brown
2015-07-16 14:46                               ` James Bottomley
2015-07-16 15:12                                 ` Mark Brown
2015-07-16 15:27                                   ` Jiri Kosina
2015-07-16 18:39                                     ` Mark Brown
2015-07-16 14:57                               ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-16 15:18                                 ` Mark Brown
2015-07-16 15:33                                   ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-16 15:04                             ` Tim Bird
2015-07-16 15:12                               ` Ralf Baechle
2015-07-16 15:26                                 ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-16 15:34                                 ` Tim Bird
2015-07-16 16:51                                 ` Mark Brown
2015-07-17 16:12                                 ` Guenter Roeck
2015-07-16 15:41                               ` Jonathan Corbet
2015-07-16 15:50                                 ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-16 15:52                                 ` Tim Bird
2015-07-16 16:10                                   ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-16 15:57                                 ` Josh Triplett
2015-07-16 15:57                                 ` Olof Johansson
2015-07-17 16:19                                   ` Guenter Roeck
2015-07-16 16:09                                 ` Tim Bird
2015-07-16 16:16                                   ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-16 16:24                                     ` Tim Bird
2015-07-16 16:52                                       ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-18  1:42                                         ` NeilBrown
2015-07-18  3:48                                           ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-31 13:09                                         ` Nicolas Ferre
2015-07-31 14:22                                           ` James Bottomley
2015-08-01 18:16                                             ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2015-08-01 18:19                                               ` James Bottomley
2015-08-01 18:42                                                 ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2015-08-01 22:16                                                   ` NeilBrown
2015-08-01 22:45                                                     ` Jiri Kosina
2015-08-03 15:49                                                       ` Mark Brown
2015-08-03 15:53                                                         ` James Bottomley
2015-08-03 16:01                                                           ` Mark Brown
2015-08-02 12:12                                                     ` Jonathan Corbet
2015-08-02 22:46                                                       ` NeilBrown
2015-07-16 16:28                                     ` Greg KH
2015-07-16 17:36                                       ` Peter Hüwe
2015-07-31 13:17                                       ` Nicolas Ferre
2015-07-17 10:16                                     ` Mel Gorman
2015-07-17 12:21                                       ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-16 16:24                                 ` James Bottomley
2015-07-16 17:15                                   ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-16 18:36                                   ` Mark Brown
2015-07-17 16:11                                   ` Jonathan Corbet
2015-07-17 16:59                                     ` Josh Triplett
2015-07-17 17:06                                       ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-17 18:59                                         ` josh
2015-07-17 17:37                                     ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-17 17:43                                       ` James Bottomley
2015-07-17 17:53                                         ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-17 19:30                                           ` Chris Mason
2015-07-17 19:46                                             ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-17 20:02                                               ` Chris Mason
2015-07-20 17:40                                                 ` Tim Bird
2015-07-20 17:58                                                   ` Chris Mason
2015-07-20 18:26                                                     ` Mark Brown
2015-07-17 18:05                                         ` Guenter Roeck
2015-07-17 19:02                                       ` josh
2015-07-17 19:43                                         ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-17 20:24                                           ` josh
2015-07-17 20:39                                             ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-17 20:48                                               ` josh
2015-07-17 20:55                                                 ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-19 22:19                                                   ` Jiri Kosina
2015-07-19 22:40                                                     ` Josh Triplett
2015-07-19 23:02                                                     ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-20  2:34                                                     ` Zefan Li
2015-07-20  5:16                                                       ` Josh Triplett
2015-07-20  5:19                                                         ` Guenter Roeck
2015-07-20  7:15                                                         ` James Bottomley
2015-07-20  8:48                                                           ` Josh Triplett
2015-07-20  9:58                                                             ` James Bottomley
2015-07-20 10:15                                                               ` David Woodhouse
2015-07-20 22:35                                                               ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2015-07-21  0:25                                                           ` NeilBrown
2015-07-20  9:08                                                         ` Zefan Li
2015-07-20  7:08                                                     ` James Bottomley
2015-07-20  8:27                                                       ` Julia Lawall
2015-07-20 20:30                                                         ` Greg KH
2015-07-20 22:12                                                           ` Guenter Roeck
2015-07-20 22:32                                                             ` Greg KH
2015-07-20 23:03                                                               ` Guenter Roeck
2015-07-20 23:49                                                                 ` Bjorn Helgaas
2015-07-21  6:08                                                                 ` Julia Lawall
2015-07-21  6:15                                                                   ` Guenter Roeck
2015-07-21  5:57                                                             ` Julia Lawall
2015-07-20  8:44                                                       ` Josh Triplett
2015-07-20  9:23                                                         ` James Bottomley
2015-07-20 10:04                                                           ` David Woodhouse
2015-07-20 10:30                                                             ` James Bottomley
2015-07-20 11:09                                                               ` David Woodhouse
2015-07-21  2:00                                                                 ` Zefan Li
2015-07-21  6:00                                                                   ` Julia Lawall
2015-07-21  8:54                                                                   ` NeilBrown
2015-07-22 13:04                                                                     ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-22 13:57                                                                       ` Bjorn Helgaas
2015-07-22 14:10                                                                         ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-22 14:42                                                                           ` James Bottomley
2015-07-22 14:44                                                                             ` James Bottomley
2015-07-22 14:48                                                                             ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-22 15:41                                                                               ` James Bottomley
2015-07-22 16:29                                                                       ` Josh Triplett
2015-07-21 17:35                                                                 ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2015-07-20 16:34                                                       ` Tim Bird
2015-07-18  6:17                                                 ` David Woodhouse
2015-07-19 22:21                                                   ` Jiri Kosina
2015-07-20  7:18                                                     ` James Bottomley
2015-07-20 11:05                                                       ` David Woodhouse
2015-07-20 12:35                                                   ` Takashi Iwai
2015-07-20 16:12                                       ` Tim Bird
2015-07-16 17:33                                 ` Peter Hüwe
2015-07-17 16:10                           ` Guenter Roeck
2015-07-17 16:23                             ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-18 12:27                               ` Laurent Pinchart
2015-07-18 10:50                           ` Dan Carpenter
2015-07-18 12:19                             ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-18 21:29                               ` Mark Brown
2015-07-18 22:59                                 ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-11 11:11                     ` Julia Lawall
2015-07-10 15:44           ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-10 16:00             ` Darren Hart
2015-07-10 16:34             ` Josh Triplett
2015-07-10 16:58               ` Darren Hart
2015-07-10 19:27               ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-10 17:32             ` Christian Couder
2015-07-10 17:49               ` Darren Hart
2015-07-10 19:35                 ` Roberto Tyley
2015-07-10 22:49                   ` Darren Hart
2015-07-10 23:18                     ` Laura Abbott
2015-07-12 10:53                     ` Roberto Tyley
2015-07-11  9:31             ` [Ksummit-discuss] checkpatch.pl stuff Dan Carpenter
2015-07-11 11:34               ` Heiko Carstens
2015-07-11 12:51                 ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-11 13:42                   ` Joe Perches
2015-07-08 14:20     ` [Ksummit-discuss] [CORE TOPIC] Recruitment (Reviewers, Testers, Maintainers, Hobbyists) Bjorn Helgaas
2015-07-08 14:34       ` Guenter Roeck
2015-07-08 15:20         ` Bjorn Helgaas
2015-07-08 19:19       ` Daniel Vetter
2015-07-08 19:48         ` Laurent Pinchart
2015-07-09  3:56         ` Michael Ellerman
2015-07-13 11:05           ` Damien Lespiau
2015-07-14  5:41             ` Michael Ellerman
2015-07-14 10:11               ` Damien Lespiau
2015-07-08 16:43   ` Mark Brown
2015-07-08 18:08     ` Jason Cooper
2015-07-08  0:16 ` Greg KH
2015-07-08 18:06   ` Mark Brown
2015-07-08 19:27     ` Laurent Pinchart
2015-07-08 19:35       ` Mark Brown
2015-07-08  1:29 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2015-07-08  1:14   ` Josh Boyer
2015-07-08  1:49     ` NeilBrown
2015-07-08  3:40       ` Davidlohr Bueso
2015-07-08  7:08       ` Peter Hüwe
2015-07-08  2:03     ` Krzysztof Kozłowski
2015-07-08  7:04       ` Peter Hüwe
2015-07-08  7:52         ` jic23
2015-07-08  9:52           ` Peter Huewe
2015-07-08 12:42         ` Jonathan Corbet
2015-07-08 15:02         ` Jason Cooper
2015-07-08 16:36           ` Guenter Roeck [this message]
2015-07-08 18:05             ` Jason Cooper
2015-07-08 19:09           ` Peter Huewe
2015-07-08 19:21             ` Jason Cooper
2015-07-08 19:35               ` Peter Huewe
2015-07-08 15:43         ` John W. Linville
2015-07-12 19:37         ` Laurent Pinchart
2015-07-08  2:11     ` Greg KH
2015-07-08  7:52       ` Dan Carpenter
2015-07-08 11:07       ` Mark Brown
2015-07-08 11:43       ` Josh Boyer
2015-07-08 18:49         ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-08 19:11           ` Josh Boyer
2015-07-08 19:38             ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-08  8:18     ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2015-07-08  7:37   ` James Bottomley
2015-07-08  8:00     ` jic23
2015-07-08  9:57       ` Peter Huewe
2015-07-08 18:53       ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-08 19:56         ` Laurent Pinchart
2015-07-08 20:07           ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-08 21:31             ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2015-07-09 17:50               ` Frank Rowand
2015-07-08 20:08         ` Guenter Roeck
2015-07-09  4:06           ` Michael Ellerman
2015-07-09 18:28             ` Frank Rowand
2015-07-09 18:53               ` Mark Brown
2015-07-09 19:23               ` Guenter Roeck
2015-07-09 19:47                 ` Darren Hart
2015-07-09 20:13                   ` Theodore Ts'o
2015-07-09 20:50                     ` Guenter Roeck
2015-07-09 21:47                       ` Theodore Ts'o
2015-07-09 23:13                         ` josh
2015-07-09 23:56                           ` Theodore Ts'o
2015-07-10 20:49                           ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-10 21:04                             ` josh
2015-07-26 23:13                             ` Paul E. McKenney
2015-07-10 18:20                         ` Guenter Roeck
2015-07-10 18:32                           ` Mark Brown
2015-07-10 18:58                           ` Jason Cooper
2015-07-10 20:24                             ` Guenter
2015-07-10 21:14                               ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2015-07-11  0:52                                 ` Guenter
2015-07-13 19:28                                   ` Luis R. Rodriguez
2015-07-11  1:04                               ` Jason Cooper
2015-07-10 21:00                             ` josh
2015-07-11  1:06                               ` Jason Cooper
2015-07-09 20:23                   ` Guenter Roeck
2015-07-09 20:48                     ` Darren Hart
2015-07-09 23:52                   ` Mark Brown
2015-07-09 19:44             ` Darren Hart
2015-07-10 21:01               ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-09 19:39         ` Darren Hart
2015-07-09 20:21           ` Dmitry Torokhov
2015-07-09 21:41             ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-10  0:14             ` Theodore Ts'o
2015-07-10  1:04               ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2015-07-10  1:54               ` Darren Hart
2015-07-10  3:13               ` Julia Lawall
2015-07-10 18:14         ` Josh Poimboeuf
2015-07-11  1:00           ` Davidlohr Bueso
2015-07-12  3:48             ` Josh Poimboeuf
2015-07-12  5:23               ` Josh Triplett
2015-07-12 12:28                 ` Josh Poimboeuf
2015-07-13 14:20                   ` Dan Carpenter
2015-07-13 14:33                     ` Jan Kara
2015-07-13 16:28                       ` Dan Carpenter
2015-07-13 17:58                         ` Jonathan Cameron
2015-07-14  4:38                         ` Sudip Mukherjee
2015-07-14  5:56                           ` Jonathan Cameron
2015-07-14  7:00                           ` Dan Carpenter
2015-07-14 15:16                           ` Greg KH
2015-07-14 15:52                             ` Josh Poimboeuf
2015-07-14 18:04                               ` Dan Carpenter
2015-07-14 18:01                             ` Dan Carpenter
2015-07-12 15:35               ` Steven Rostedt
2015-07-08 14:07 ` Jason Cooper
2015-07-08 19:29   ` Peter Huewe
2015-07-08 22:18     ` Jason Cooper
2015-07-08 23:09       ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2015-07-12 19:53         ` Laurent Pinchart
2015-07-09 15:09       ` John W. Linville
2015-07-09 17:45         ` Guenter Roeck
2015-07-09 18:08           ` John W. Linville
2015-07-10 13:07             ` Jason Cooper
2015-07-09 18:37         ` Olof Johansson
2015-07-09 19:02         ` Darren Hart
2015-07-10 13:03         ` Jason Cooper
2015-07-08 17:55 ` Mark Brown

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