From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from relay.hostedemail.com (smtprelay0015.hostedemail.com [216.40.44.15]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.subspace.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D1E4B171CD for ; Sun, 18 Jan 2026 16:05:05 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; arc=none smtp.client-ip=216.40.44.15 ARC-Seal:i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=subspace.kernel.org; s=arc-20240116; t=1768752307; cv=none; b=AUwav5d2hDgW3drUXh/O64TQiayAHbmGoSIkTBoEnrPTCQwVAj5o7Ck2dwDE0UFoB9auGSky+bWmQrl8M/+f7nYnYCfkBMpgUe0VAOn7Rg3j2QM7Uxyl9PECNgMOinjKQyYSm/fQpcWePVMQuT2yhupkFL0L2XLYxHXXTHRg7TE= ARC-Message-Signature:i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=subspace.kernel.org; s=arc-20240116; t=1768752307; c=relaxed/simple; bh=Ffo0W/ZOsqP785D+OFgx9XrayYUV+4phCNMC1hAClg4=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:References: MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=T5uWMmI33KCVZLoAjOcun8d5KhjWVnUtjJDL+hD86HvZy9VzvFhw9gRCfJ/jVIUpF+sjBGbBsWx3w/dukx6LPpKrkGrbLRMt1l1fPHALbGsr2ajgmInXXoXzrfelwnF6jqd6j4r4hb1oj8cEyuUZGlF7Qq6beuYFw21mEwkdWZI= ARC-Authentication-Results:i=1; smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dmarc=pass (p=none dis=none) header.from=goodmis.org; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=goodmis.org; arc=none smtp.client-ip=216.40.44.15 Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dmarc=pass (p=none dis=none) header.from=goodmis.org Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=goodmis.org Received: from omf14.hostedemail.com (a10.router.float.18 [10.200.18.1]) by unirelay10.hostedemail.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49F96C2079; Sun, 18 Jan 2026 16:04:58 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [HIDDEN] (Authenticated sender: rostedt@goodmis.org) by omf14.hostedemail.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 45C252D; Sun, 18 Jan 2026 16:04:56 +0000 (UTC) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2026 11:04:54 -0500 From: Steven Rostedt To: Alexey Dobriyan Cc: Andy Shevchenko , James Bottomley , ksummit@lists.linux.dev, Dan Williams , linux-kernel , Dan Carpenter Subject: Re: Clarifying confusion of our variable placement rules caused by cleanup.h Message-ID: <20260118110454.4d51a50a@robin> In-Reply-To: <38d7b19f-b6ff-437b-bc88-fa2047ca556a@p183> References: <58fd478f408a34b578ee8d949c5c4b4da4d4f41d.camel@HansenPartnership.com> <7b37e1cb-271e-49fe-a3ee-5443006284e1@p183> <20260102095029.03481f90@gandalf.local.home> <38d7b19f-b6ff-437b-bc88-fa2047ca556a@p183> X-Mailer: Claws Mail 4.3.1 (GTK 3.24.51; x86_64-redhat-linux-gnu) Precedence: bulk X-Mailing-List: ksummit@lists.linux.dev List-Id: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Stat-Signature: 1m7io55whfohtayu8zgfem3s1jotkje4 X-Rspamd-Server: rspamout04 X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 45C252D X-Session-Marker: 726F737465647440676F6F646D69732E6F7267 X-Session-ID: U2FsdGVkX183q7gpo5GToNE1rBgBYWjgpZSa90InMpw= X-HE-Tag: 1768752296-667103 X-HE-Meta: U2FsdGVkX18SZqvtGF5pspEuSly3UVOleiNmijpoFlSUHOmt+BpS/rAqIgB+4KeszWETkpm6oCvBdMIj6l4zKEGDMCK3MfplAgqqVEgZUidADYVDHg4X06HVJpbN7f3MYBLeidFJsSGjb8kpIYzxUW7R7QkTN4b4z75woYDD55e1oiat5BdJTQQPsjgYHVsvtqBPNV5IY28sD/LUOLasOY3pXQ9DmqVpylfe8POh8y4jtQvGPOWaoKeRdqY2ekb6n8FD7l0RQhLhZPVtpOXMeA6hN6f98jzb1ptYWCA18w8gMIXY6vbCxdgXRA/cx9OuWHG5R7Svut2DVkNIv2unSYQT7rnM6/qi On Sat, 17 Jan 2026 19:23:07 +0300 Alexey Dobriyan wrote: > Such rules for headers are mostly harmless -- headers are supposed to be > idempotent so ordering doesn't matter. But if ordering doesn't matter > why have a rule at all? As I mentioned, for aesthetic reasons only. If code is easy to look at, it's easier to review. Especially for those with OCD ;-) > > Duplicate header are trivially caught by tooling. > > But such rules aren't useful either -- I've seen that Python IDEs hide > import list by default (and probably manage it) because it is not "real" > code. > > Rules for initializers can be harmful because ordering affects code > generation. I agree. I still prefer the upside-down x-mas tree approach for declaring variables, but obviously if they also get initialized, then that trumps aesthetic reasoning. -- Steve