From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from smtp.kernel.org (aws-us-west-2-korg-mail-1.web.codeaurora.org [10.30.226.201]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.subspace.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3B77C7F for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2023 13:47:51 +0000 (UTC) Received: by smtp.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 8F736C433C7; Tue, 22 Aug 2023 13:47:50 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=kernel.org; s=k20201202; t=1692712071; bh=VFpzY3oFUrBUNENy74/K4zRvkl0uD8rnFeX7VygDOD0=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:From; b=R9+gWMDh0LkxITjO5Pp8IczCkh30RarlZjKNH4jrH33MUiCKC+OIisAj+GJ86GAzz MIxzMAzT84P0sk5dEAePNKiuFH1QOLdERCBPEerlaaZ1ecFCKttFIVOJpwuLgWnQGs 0yjE+LHZkfTOratKVeVTV5+/UZsTY3TbQTWFP4GGSvIA88tyaVx6EhcujyH+5ZV6q9 xCTnyU1c/uln04Y0dJNqxqnnjVq7LhvyHoK5ovbuRDhOT0GIYlmIZpSmplVRwZIw9b VETxj8GkXvOd3vy2MJ8XvoQYMs2cANvhvLBo2ZhMf5VMZ1mC25FwO9UJsqshkMNq1k y5PvVKzp2bPyA== Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2023 16:47:46 +0300 From: Leon Romanovsky To: Laurent Pinchart Cc: Jan Kara , Vegard Nossum , Linus Torvalds , Jakub Kicinski , Linus Walleij , Alexei Starovoitov , Andrew Lunn , Luis Chamberlain , Josef Bacik , ksummit@lists.linux.dev, Jeff Layton , Song Liu Subject: Re: [MAINTAINERS SUMMIT] Maintainer burnout Message-ID: <20230822134746.GC6029@unreal> References: <20230817081957.1287b966@kernel.org> <20230818080949.7b17b0d5@kernel.org> <20230819064537.GM22185@unreal> <20230822094613.bxtsjlnkhaypoflj@quack3> <20230822110523.GB6029@unreal> <20230822113212.GP10135@pendragon.ideasonboard.com> Precedence: bulk X-Mailing-List: ksummit@lists.linux.dev List-Id: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20230822113212.GP10135@pendragon.ideasonboard.com> On Tue, Aug 22, 2023 at 02:32:12PM +0300, Laurent Pinchart wrote: > On Tue, Aug 22, 2023 at 02:05:23PM +0300, Leon Romanovsky wrote: > > On Tue, Aug 22, 2023 at 11:46:13AM +0200, Jan Kara wrote: > > > On Mon 21-08-23 21:23:18, Vegard Nossum wrote: > > > > On 8/19/23 08:45, Leon Romanovsky wrote: > > > > > It is worth to try to get honest feedback from active developers/contributors/vendors > > > > > what is their "real" excuse for not doing code review. > > > > > > > > > > I saw in this thread about "have no time to do code review" answers and we > > > > > all can relate to it, but IMHO it is just an excuse and not the real reason. > > > > > Especially for a people who are employed by big corporations to do their > > > > > upstream work. <...> > > > > The incentives that remain (as far as I can tell) are: > > > > > > > > 1) you get familiar with a specific part of the kernel, and > > > > 2) you get goodwill and recognition from other kernel developers. > > > > > > I agree it is good to create positive incentives to provide good review. > > > But I believe what really makes people do good reviews is the sense of > > > common responsibility. > > > > Agree as long as "people" word includes whole community together with > > maintainers to share common responsibility. > > > > Some maintainers feel too much ownership other their subsystems and it > > causes to the lack of trust from everybody involved in the process and > > common responsibility can't be built in that subsystems at all. > > Do we need to organize a workshop for maintainers on how to stop > clinging to power ? I'm sure I could learn something there. Probably, everyone who will attend that workshop will need to pass a qualification exam what "maintainer" term means for different groups: * Corporate management * Community * Other kernel developers Thanks > > -- > Regards, > > Laurent Pinchart