From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (smtp1.linux-foundation.org [172.17.192.35]) by mail.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 604D5158C for ; Fri, 5 Jul 2019 20:12:34 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail.kernel.org (mail.kernel.org [198.145.29.99]) by smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 82EF987B for ; Fri, 5 Jul 2019 20:12:33 +0000 (UTC) Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2019 16:12:31 -0400 From: Sasha Levin To: Mark Brown Message-ID: <20190705201231.GI10104@sasha-vm> References: <20190703013557.GQ11506@sasha-vm> <20190705164142.GC20625@sirena.org.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20190705164142.GC20625@sirena.org.uk> Cc: ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org Subject: Re: [Ksummit-discuss] [MAINTAINERS SUMMIT] stable kernel process automation and improvement List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , On Fri, Jul 05, 2019 at 05:41:42PM +0100, Mark Brown wrote: >On Tue, Jul 02, 2019 at 09:35:57PM -0400, Sasha Levin wrote: > >> - Concerns about how well -stable kernels are tested. >> - "Fixes for fixes" end up being missed. >> - Saner AUTOSEL process. > >I'm a bit worried about these, especially pushed together - one >of the things the AUTOSEL stuff does quite often is pull in >driver changes and our coverage of drivers is especially weak. Our driver coverage is indeed weak, but I don't think that the solution is to leave drivers/ alone. On the contrary, I think that making drivers/ move quickly together with the rest of the kernel will encourage vendors to up their testing game. This came up in the last MS, and the agreement there was that we expect stable kernel users to test their workloads before throwing it into production. If we were to start avoiding driver updates, it would act as an incentive for people not to upgrade their kernel. Right now I'm working with a certain hardware vendor who does a crappy job at tagging fixes for stable, and it's horribly painful. I end up spending time triaging a bug, reporting it to the vendor, only to be told "oh grab this fix from upstream". This user experience is just bad, and I can't imagine how difficult it is for users who are less familiar with the kerenl. -- Thanks, Sasha