From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (smtp1.linux-foundation.org [172.17.192.35]) by mail.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 867A3AD1 for ; Mon, 22 Oct 2018 11:03:04 +0000 (UTC) Received: from bedivere.hansenpartnership.com (bedivere.hansenpartnership.com [66.63.167.143]) by smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id AF5297A8 for ; Mon, 22 Oct 2018 11:03:02 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <1540206166.2815.24.camel@HansenPartnership.com> From: James Bottomley To: NeilBrown , Greg Kroah-Hartman , linux-kernel , Linus Torvalds Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2018 12:02:46 +0100 In-Reply-To: <87y3ar80ac.fsf@notabene.neil.brown.name> References: <20181020134908.GA32218@kroah.com> <87y3ar80ac.fsf@notabene.neil.brown.name> Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha256"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-TaFZnUKXD7/gTOc36swC" Mime-Version: 1.0 Cc: Mishi Choudhary , ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org Subject: Re: [Ksummit-discuss] Call to Action Re: [PATCH 0/7] Code of Conduct: Fix some wording, and add an interpretation document List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , --=-TaFZnUKXD7/gTOc36swC Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Mon, 2018-10-22 at 08:20 +1100, NeilBrown wrote: > On Sat, Oct 20 2018, Greg Kroah-Hartman wrote: >=20 > > Hi all, > >=20 > > As everyone knows by now, we added a new Code of Conduct to the > > kernel tree a few weeks ago. >=20 > I wanted to stay detached from all this, but as remaining (publicly) > silent might be seen (publicly) as acquiescing, I hereby declare > that: > I reject, as illegitimate, this Code and the process by > which it is being "developed". >=20 > It is clear from the surrounding discussions that this is well > outside our core competencies. It will be flawed, it isn't what we > need. >=20 > I call on any other community members who reject this process to say > so, not to remain silent. > #Iobject Well, I've got to say we really know how to screw up the process by ramming this in at the last minute (again): https://git.kernel.org/pub/scm/linux/kernel/git/torvalds/linux.git/commit/?= id=3D8e630c31a3dfc7f4ab1007f95dd507cb2fe1dda5 So yes, I'll certainly object to our inability to follow an open process. > We don't need a "Code of Conduct" nearly as much as we need > "Leadership in conduct". Without the leadership, any code looks like > a joke. I do think we need something in document form, though. Not least because we do have a perception problem which having a document helps allay, mostly for external not internal perceptions. As I've said several times, we have been steadily getting better thanks mostly to internal people helping drive more civilised discussions and being more helpful to new patch submitters. I've also previously pointed out that I really like the debian code of conduct: https://www.debian.org/code_of_conduct But now that I'm in Edinburgh, I had a conversation with Jeremy Allison. Apparently the Samba community went through almost exactly the same thing as were going through now: attempt initially to impose the contributor covenant followed by an acrimonious argument (done mostly in private). However, one interesting thing for us might be their final endpoint: https://wiki.samba.org/index.php/How_to_do_Samba:_Nicely Which, like the debian document is a nicely engineered statement of values which is specifically tailored to their community and needs.=20 The interesting thing is that eventually everyone in Samba agreed to this, including the people who initially tried to impose the contributor covenant. James --=-TaFZnUKXD7/gTOc36swC Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iHUEABMIAB0WIQTnYEDbdso9F2cI+arnQslM7pishQUCW82uVwAKCRDnQslM7pis hdUkAQDR2/xJd4K6zkWwSHOs8PlnbjdF/oGSchnfVkrmoZJRXQD+Jh0Z8zISqLOO NKMV7S3CKJnCTVuxK6LJ6JcD1j20XNM= =vlsK -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-TaFZnUKXD7/gTOc36swC--