From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (smtp1.linux-foundation.org [172.17.192.35]) by mail.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 970B4CAB for ; Sun, 9 Sep 2018 17:48:52 +0000 (UTC) Received: from twosheds.infradead.org (twosheds.infradead.org [90.155.92.209]) by smtp1.linuxfoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 22DAB102 for ; Sun, 9 Sep 2018 17:48:52 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <1536515316.5768.48.camel@infradead.org> From: David Woodhouse To: "Theodore Y. Ts'o" , Andy Lutomirski In-Reply-To: <20180909172039.GE22251@thunk.org> References: <20180908082141.15d72684@coco.lan> <20180908113411.GA3111@kroah.com> <1536418829.22308.1.camel@HansenPartnership.com> <20180908153235.GB11120@kroah.com> <1536422066.22308.3.camel@HansenPartnership.com> <20180909125130.GA16474@kroah.com> <1536503930.3192.2.camel@HansenPartnership.com> <6ECFDF7E-2674-4096-BFB5-25243D62913E@amacapital.net> <20180909172039.GE22251@thunk.org> Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="sha-256"; protocol="application/x-pkcs7-signature"; boundary="=-QhoXwaee/7YHggbYOham" Date: Sun, 09 Sep 2018 18:48:36 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 Cc: James Bottomley , mchehab+samsung@kernel.org, ksummit Subject: Re: [Ksummit-discuss] [MAINTAINERS SUMMIT] Handling of embargoed security issues List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , --=-QhoXwaee/7YHggbYOham Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, 2018-09-09 at 13:20 -0400, Theodore Y. Ts'o wrote: >=20 > The only middle ground is "gentleman's agreement".=C2=A0 The main problem > any legal agreement is what are the teeth if someone violates the NDA > and breaks the embargo.=C2=A0 The reason why it will be very hard for som= e > third-party, like the LF, to sign any kind of NDA on behalf of > independent developers is that it puts the liability risk on the LF. > And the LF's lawyers aren't going to be comfortable with this. >=20 > We've been through this before with the TAB and getting all of the TAB > members under an NDA so we could talk about pre-standardized UEFI > proposals.=C2=A0 We looked at trying to get the LF to sign an NDA for the > TAB members who didn't work for companies which had an NDA with UEFI, > and it just didn't work.=C2=A0 Ultimately, what we did is we negotiated a > specific NDA just for me (where it would be my house on the line in > terms of an NDA violation), and I then had to get the Google's lawyers > to OK my signing it as a personal NDA.=C2=A0 The whole process took > **months**. In practice there's not really a lot of difference between a "real" NDA and a gentlepersons' agreement. Nobody's *really* going to lose their house; all that's likely to happen if you screw up is that they won't include you in the party next time round. We *had* a breach before the Spectre/Meltdown embargo was supposed to be over, and to my knowledge (and I *hope*) nothing actually happened except a bit of tutting. --=-QhoXwaee/7YHggbYOham Content-Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExDzANBglghkgBZQMEAgEFADCABgkqhkiG9w0BBwEAAKCCEFQw ggUxMIIEGaADAgECAhBNRhEyk/HZ7naOeTHWrzuAMA0GCSqGSIb3DQEBCwUAMIGXMQswCQYDVQQG EwJHQjEbMBkGA1UECBMSR3JlYXRlciBNYW5jaGVzdGVyMRAwDgYDVQQHEwdTYWxmb3JkMRowGAYD VQQKExFDT01PRE8gQ0EgTGltaXRlZDE9MDsGA1UEAxM0Q09NT0RPIFJTQSBDbGllbnQgQXV0aGVu dGljYXRpb24gYW5kIFNlY3VyZSBFbWFpbCBDQTAeFw0xNzEyMjEwMDAwMDBaFw0xODEyMjEyMzU5 NTlaMCQxIjAgBgkqhkiG9w0BCQEWE2R3bXcyQGluZnJhZGVhZC5vcmcwggEiMA0GCSqGSIb3DQEB AQUAA4IBDwAwggEKAoIBAQDgzLNWa18DNpGUj/ZeH0Sgz53ESIbzdPw3OJeuNP6jZhxZojbyfxbM hETscxI/Hj6UZ4a7sHm5BkVjlsB1Af2Za/PXUt8MmLAcPMHkMPGunvkUibEvblDvpqMkQZlaZM+t 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