From: James Bottomley <James.Bottomley@HansenPartnership.com>
To: Mark Brown <broonie@kernel.org>,
Laurent Pinchart <laurent.pinchart@ideasonboard.com>
Cc: "ltsi-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org"
<ltsi-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org>,
"gregkh@linuxfoundation.org" <gregkh@linuxfoundation.org>,
ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org
Subject: Re: [Ksummit-discuss] [Stable kernel] feature backporting collaboration
Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2016 11:30:31 -0400 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <1473175831.17204.29.camel@HansenPartnership.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20160906003532.GA3950@sirena.org.uk>
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1953 bytes --]
On Tue, 2016-09-06 at 01:35 +0100, Mark Brown wrote:
> On Mon, Sep 05, 2016 at 05:22:59PM +0300, Laurent Pinchart wrote:
> > On Monday 05 Sep 2016 10:03:27 Theodore Ts'o wrote:
> > > This is why upstream-first is so darned important. And why
> > > sloppy patches that break other architectures are a really bad
> > > idea, even if they are for a vendor-only BSP kernel....
>
> You're preaching to the converted here but just telling everyone over
> and over again that they're doing a terrible job isn't helping
> anything. It's not offering any sort of constructive suggestion for
> how to improve the situation that engages with the reality on the
> ground.
OK, so how do we move forwards? Everyone who remembers the 2.4->2.6
transition is convinced of upstream first because it was impossible to
forward port the patch sets.
However, with the 2.6 release methodology, you have much smaller patch
sets and we have a much more incremental release strategy, meaning you
don't have this massive (2 year) gap between upports. I think it's
arguable that our change in release strategy coupled with you getting
enough stuff upstream supports vendors who want to target a stable tree
because the patch difference is big but not that huge to upport.
So there's probably a couple of things we could do about this
1. Nothing. Say it's working about as well as can be expected for
embedded and stop worrying.
2. Accept that the pain will never be great enough and approach from a
process view point instead. Perhaps changing the acceptance
criteria for the base tree to make it harder to get features in
making it less painful to get them upstream and then backported?
3. Increase the pain. Not sure I like this, but in theory, we could
churn the upstream API to increase the pain of upports, but it would
also cause a lot of issues with backports.
James
[-- Attachment #2: This is a digitally signed message part --]
[-- Type: application/pgp-signature, Size: 819 bytes --]
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2016-09-06 15:30 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 122+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2016-09-01 2:01 Alex Shi
2016-09-02 1:25 ` Levin, Alexander
2016-09-02 2:43 ` Stephen Hemminger
2016-09-02 9:59 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-02 9:54 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-02 10:16 ` [Ksummit-discuss] [LTSI-dev] " Geert Uytterhoeven
2016-09-02 14:42 ` [Ksummit-discuss] " James Bottomley
2016-09-02 14:55 ` Rik van Riel
2016-09-02 15:04 ` James Bottomley
2016-09-02 15:39 ` Rik van Riel
2016-09-02 17:06 ` Bird, Timothy
2016-09-05 1:45 ` NeilBrown
2016-09-05 11:04 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-05 22:44 ` NeilBrown
2016-09-06 0:57 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-06 5:41 ` NeilBrown
2016-09-08 18:33 ` [Ksummit-discuss] [LTSI-dev] " Bird, Timothy
2016-09-08 22:38 ` NeilBrown
2016-09-09 11:01 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-09 22:17 ` NeilBrown
2016-09-12 17:37 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-13 7:46 ` NeilBrown
2016-09-13 17:53 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-02 18:21 ` [Ksummit-discuss] " Olof Johansson
2016-09-02 23:35 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-03 5:29 ` Guenter Roeck
2016-09-03 10:40 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-04 0:10 ` Theodore Ts'o
2016-09-04 8:34 ` gregkh
2016-09-04 22:58 ` Amit Kucheria
2016-09-04 23:51 ` Theodore Ts'o
2016-09-05 12:58 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-05 11:11 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-05 14:03 ` Theodore Ts'o
2016-09-05 14:22 ` Laurent Pinchart
2016-09-06 0:35 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-06 15:30 ` James Bottomley [this message]
2016-09-06 19:44 ` gregkh
2016-09-06 22:20 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-06 22:34 ` James Bottomley
2016-09-08 18:55 ` Bird, Timothy
2016-09-08 19:19 ` gregkh
2016-09-09 10:45 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-09 11:03 ` gregkh
2016-09-09 11:48 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-06 23:23 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-06 13:34 ` Catalin Marinas
2016-09-06 16:24 ` Bartlomiej Zolnierkiewicz
2016-09-06 16:25 ` Guenter Roeck
2016-09-06 22:39 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-07 8:33 ` Jan Kara
2016-09-07 8:41 ` Jiri Kosina
2016-09-07 18:44 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-08 17:06 ` Frank Rowand
2016-09-09 10:32 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-09 15:21 ` Alex Shi
2016-09-12 15:34 ` Christoph Hellwig
2016-09-06 16:46 ` Olof Johansson
2016-09-08 8:34 ` Linus Walleij
2016-09-08 8:55 ` Vinod Koul
2016-09-09 14:32 ` Rob Herring
2016-09-09 14:23 ` Rob Herring
[not found] ` <2181684.5VzIQ6DWv4@amdc1976>
2016-09-07 9:32 ` Catalin Marinas
2016-09-07 13:07 ` Bartlomiej Zolnierkiewicz
2016-09-07 18:49 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-09 15:06 ` Alex Shi
2016-09-02 23:29 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-02 19:16 ` Levin, Alexander
2016-09-03 0:05 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-05 9:28 ` Laurent Pinchart
2016-09-21 6:58 ` Alex Shi
2016-09-21 9:23 ` gregkh
2016-09-21 14:52 ` Alex Shi
2016-09-21 15:28 ` gregkh
2016-09-21 18:50 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-22 3:15 ` Alex Shi
2016-09-21 18:22 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-21 18:54 ` Linus Walleij
2016-09-21 19:52 ` Theodore Ts'o
2016-09-22 0:43 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-22 5:20 ` gregkh
2016-09-22 12:56 ` Laurent Pinchart
2016-09-22 16:22 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-22 22:14 ` Theodore Ts'o
2016-09-23 12:28 ` Laurent Pinchart
2016-09-23 13:27 ` [Ksummit-discuss] [LTSI-dev] " Alex Shi
2016-09-23 13:40 ` Laurent Pinchart
2016-09-23 14:40 ` [Ksummit-discuss] " Mark Brown
2016-09-21 13:56 ` Theodore Ts'o
2016-09-21 15:23 ` Alex Shi
2016-09-21 15:33 ` gregkh
2016-09-21 19:16 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-02 13:47 ` Theodore Ts'o
2016-09-02 19:31 ` Levin, Alexander
2016-09-02 19:42 ` gregkh
2016-09-02 20:06 ` Levin, Alexander
2016-09-03 2:04 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-06 7:20 ` [Ksummit-discuss] [LTSI-dev] " Tsugikazu Shibata
2016-09-10 12:00 ` Theodore Ts'o
2016-09-12 16:27 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-12 17:14 ` Greg KH
2016-09-12 23:45 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-13 3:14 ` Theodore Ts'o
2016-09-13 10:14 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-13 13:19 ` Levin, Alexander
2016-09-13 6:19 ` Greg KH
2016-09-13 10:38 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-13 12:09 ` Greg KH
2016-09-13 12:20 ` Josh Boyer
2016-09-13 13:12 ` Greg KH
2016-09-13 16:23 ` Bird, Timothy
2016-09-13 19:02 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-14 14:47 ` Alex Shi
2016-09-20 5:15 ` Tsugikazu Shibata
2016-09-21 8:46 ` Alex Shi
2016-09-13 12:25 ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2016-09-13 19:21 ` Mark Brown
2016-09-14 1:49 ` Greg KH
2016-09-14 3:00 ` Guenter Roeck
2016-09-12 4:12 ` Alex Shi
2016-09-12 16:09 ` Masami Hiramatsu
2016-09-13 2:39 ` Alex Shi
Reply instructions:
You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:
* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
and reply-to-all from there: mbox
Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style
* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
switches of git-send-email(1):
git send-email \
--in-reply-to=1473175831.17204.29.camel@HansenPartnership.com \
--to=james.bottomley@hansenpartnership.com \
--cc=broonie@kernel.org \
--cc=gregkh@linuxfoundation.org \
--cc=ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org \
--cc=laurent.pinchart@ideasonboard.com \
--cc=ltsi-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org \
/path/to/YOUR_REPLY
https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html
* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line
before the message body.
This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox