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([2001:a61:2b4d:5001:a0ac:8837:60fe:9611]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 5b1f17b1804b1-459e5879d76sm36328285e9.24.2025.08.05.23.58.20 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 05 Aug 2025 23:58:20 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <0b58487e-56fe-448c-ba22-80a2e7dab763@suse.com> Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2025 08:58:20 +0200 Precedence: bulk X-Mailing-List: ksummit@lists.linux.dev List-Id: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: [MAINTAINERS SUMMIT] The role of AI and LLMs in the kernel process To: Jiri Kosina , James Bottomley Cc: Lorenzo Stoakes , ksummit@lists.linux.dev References: <56e85d392471beea3322d19bde368920ba6323b6.camel@HansenPartnership.com> <16p76q9o-7274-901o-4980-764o681q400o@xreary.bet> Content-Language: en-US From: Hannes Reinecke In-Reply-To: <16p76q9o-7274-901o-4980-764o681q400o@xreary.bet> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On 8/5/25 23:58, Jiri Kosina wrote: > On Tue, 5 Aug 2025, James Bottomley wrote: > >>> * Equally, LLM's can introduce very subtle mistakes that humans find >>> difficult to pick up upon - humans implicitly assume that the classes >>> of errors they will encounter are the kinds other humans would make - >>> AI defeats that instinct. >> >> Do you have any examples of this? I've found the opposite to be true: >> AI is capable of really big stupid mistakes when it hasn't seen enough >> of the pattern, but I can't recall seeing it make something you'd >> classify as a subtle mistake (I assume it could copy subtle mistakes >> from wrong training data, so I'm not saying it can't, just that I >> haven't seen any). > > Few months ago (so state of matters has probably changed a lot since > then, I have no idea), I've seen a GPIO driver fully written by ChatGPT. > > It was functionally correct and worked well. But it was missing error > handle here-and-there. Is it subtle or big? > Which (curiously enough) raises another point: Procrastination. We (as developers) are _terrible_ at things which we _should_ do, but for some reason or other never get around to do properly or at all. To wit: Error handling. Or: documentation. Yet the code base we have written will be used as training material for LLM. So I am not surprised that LLM lack in the very same areas (how could they otherwise? There is not enough training material...). And I guess the last thing we want is LLMs inventing error handling. But anyway. LLMs are great in producing something where 90% accuracy is good enough. But that's not how coding works; so one always will have to review any LLM generated code. And that at a time where we already have issues finding enough reviewers for code written by humans. Cheers, Hannes -- Dr. Hannes Reinecke Kernel Storage Architect hare@suse.com +49 911 74053 688 SUSE Software Solutions GmbH, Frankenstr. 146, 90461 Nürnberg HRB 36809 (AG Nürnberg), GF: I. Totev, A. McDonald, W. Knoblich